Amy - A friend

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Lance
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Amy - A friend

Post by Lance »

I got a request from a friend of mine. It's a bit over my head, but I told her I'd look and maybe ask some other people. Here's the heart of the question:
. . . My husband and I have experienced two miscarriages in the past several months, and I am feeling a bit lost. I wondered if there was anything [astrologically] that might provide insight to this struggle we're experiencing. I feel like giving up, but my husband's heart is set on kids. It's also jumbled up with career goals on my end and having to make a choice between pursuing my own financial success and settling with something that would easier for a family. . .
Amy Fakename
May 13, 1983
3:21 AM
Beaumont, TX


The only thing I can find is in her progressed chart.

p Mars partile square r Asc
p Saturn partile conjunct r Pluto (which seems to fit the autonomy part of her question)

Anybody see anything else?

Is this a good question for astrology, or does she just need to go to the fertility clinic?

Given the p Saturn to r Pluto, how would you counsel the second part of her question? Any thoughts?

Thanks in advance.
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Jim Eshelman
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Re: Amy - A friend

Post by Jim Eshelman »

Before digging into predictive work, let's look at the natal.

As far as I have anything solid to go on (in the absence of a real study on astrology and female fertility), this seems a difficult chart for conception. Taurus Moon should encourage it, but the Moon-Mars close conjunction may bring complications. There are also what I consider more relationship (marriage pattern) aspects than child-bearing per se, specifically Venus opposite Neptune with both closely trine-sextile a close Saturn-Pluto conjunction. There is at least ambivalence…

Which brings us to her career aspirations: She's an Aries with Mars conjunct both luminaries. This causes me to take quite seriously her brief remarks. (The "choice" she mentions in the last sentence is really a tug of war between her Sun and her Moon.)

So I'm not sure her heart is into this. In any case, that's important in interpreting what success" looks like to her. If (as will happen in a few months) she suddenly had Jupiter opposite her Sun, would this more likely indicate conception or a career move?

Transiting Neptune is crossing her Ascendant: The next year or two will probably bring more confusion, not less. (It's octile her Saturn, so her sense of security is probably undercut right now. Uranus opposite her Saturn doesn't replenish it, either, but rather encourages her to break out of old molds. Her future and unknown is struggling with her past and familiar.) Sun-Saturn opposition in space today is along her Venus - was the question stirred today?

I think counselling would be of significant use to her right now to sort out what's important to her and how to navigate them.

Her relatively new SSR has transiting Neptune rising square her Jupiter-Uranus at MC, so there are some definite uncertainties about her career and general unfolding. Over the course of the SSR year, Moon will oppose natal Pluto and Saturn, and will conjoin solar Mercury-Uranus right in the middle of them: She has a big surprise coming around October when Moon-Mercury-Uranus is exact, and some potentially separation events or personal crises before and after.
Jim Eshelman
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Lance
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Re: Amy - A friend

Post by Lance »

Thank you very much.

Next I have to figure out how much of that I want to tell her.

Is that okay to say out loud? lol
Lance
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Re: Amy - A friend

Post by Lance »

Sun-Saturn opposition in space today is along her Venus - was the question stirred today?
June 26, 2018
2:39 PM
Houston, TX
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Jim Eshelman
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Re: Amy - A friend

Post by Jim Eshelman »

Lance wrote: Tue Jun 26, 2018 3:06 pm
Sun-Saturn opposition in space today is along her Venus - was the question stirred today?
June 26, 2018
2:39 PM
Houston, TX
I'm still not sure how valid horary astrology is, though I'm starting to get an idea of technique. First, though, let's look at the angles of the "event chart" for asking the question.

t Pluto on IC +2°06'
t Mercury on MC -4°02'
r Pluto on Asc -4°05'
r Saturn on As -8°28'

This is quite interesting. Not only are transiting Mercury and Pluto the two planets on angles when the question was asked, natal Pluto was rising so that t Mercury was in 0°03' of perfect mundane square to natal Pluto - both of the m being 4° shy of their angles. This is an aspect noted for "The Question," a confrontation with an inquiry that needs an unambiguous answer. It does seem she's under pressure - or, at that moment, was feeling under pressure to produce some kind of answer.

I'm led to inquire whether there are problems in the marriage. Every different way I look at this seems to me another form of her seeing an either/or decision and perhaps under pressure to produce children with uncertainty how that's going to impact the rest of her life; so a really important question is how the marriage is doing.

If I look at the chart for the time of the question as a horary chart, I till start by noting that Pluto is on IC and Mercury at MC. This seems to restate the dueling choices between career and home-family, and where she's really sitting with all of this. (Remember, this is experimental: I'm just reading what I see.) Mercury at MC is commerce, a trade, "doing business," and even learning in relation to career. Pluto on IC shows at least a substantial shift, and probably a real disruption or interruption, in home-family, i.e., her private, personal life.

If we go a bit more "classic horary," Virgo is rising - already a confirmation of the broad type of question, since its symbolism deals with themes of the relative fertility of a woman - and Virgo's ruler, Mercury, is at MC. This would be taken as "what's going on with her, what her real situation is." That would lead me to read that the "what's so," where she's really situated psychologically, is that (1) this is a legitimate question about her fertility and (2) she primarily thinks of herself in terms of the career she wants, even in conditions where it likely would be disruptive to the home.

Moon is moving away from aspects to Venus and Neptune: These love and merger needs are behind her, and it is unclear what's ahead of her (no active applying Moon aspects). Moon is also moving away from the 3rd house and establishing herself in the 2nd, as if to say that "staying close to home" and managing local-adjacent circumstances is falling behind her, while moving out into the world and taking affirmative charge competitively - something natural to her with Sun, Moon, Mars, and Mercury in the 2nd house at birth - is where she's headed. (This is essentially the identical placement of Moon in her birth chart, just a couple of degrees past the 3rd cusp.)

There are many fine points, and one doesn't want to over read the chart unless a planet ties itself in to the pattern directly. For example, one shouldn't over-read Uranus in the 7th, since nothing has drawn us there yet. The aspects alone show many kinds of emotions in the air. It is hard to ignore that partile Sun-Saturn opposition, though, and 9in this way of looking at things) that is not a pro-fertility aspect and it is "the unhappy husband." Sun-Saturn in turn is trine-sextile Uranus in the 7th - ah, that's what brings it in! - so his unhappiness is tied into the possibility of a change in the marital state. It would seem to have something to do with 3rd-9th house matters, and I don't know what that might be here.

Sun opposite Saturn is applying - the next major aspect to become exact. The ball seems to be in his court. (If we went deeper into classic horary, we'd have to note that Saturn is the ruler of the 5th house - pregnancy-children seeming, on the surface, to be the nature of the question - so it is intimately connected. I'm not sure I'd like to go that far.)

OK, now remember: I'm not sure there's anything to this, but I thought I'd read it as it came and see what spilled out. I'm not sure how astromantic that was.
Jim Eshelman
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Lance
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Re: Amy - A friend

Post by Lance »

Thanks, I appreciate that. It's very interesting. And it sounds a whole lot like their situation. He comes from a more male dominant culture where the women are child-bearers at home. He desires that. She's independent and has a lot of career ambition.

Disclaimers noted.

Thanks again.
mikestar13
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Re: Amy - A friend

Post by mikestar13 »

Lance, you may find this thread about Horary Astrology Sidereal-style of interest: https://www.solunars.com/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=1843
Time matters
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