Saggitarius planetry energy and duality

[Soft Alpaca]

So I've come to realise that Saggitarius has duality, one side being that of a king (arrogant, stubborn, regal, dominant) the Other side being more mercenary like (ruthless, unyielding, power hungry).

So where is the duality in its planerty structure? Sagittarius is ruled by Jupiter yet time and time again in seeing Mars in Saggitarius. I understand Saggitarius is "civil" it's symbol describing the the becoming of man. Yet in the people I meet in life in seeing much more half and half, man and animal. Closer maybe to the phallic winged hooved creature Saggitarius was originally thought as.

That being said how is it possible Mars could have more influence (outside of the three signs it already is associated with).

Like antares, the bightests stars of Saggitarius are not only associated with Jupiter but also Mars.

Maybe I'm stuck in the stone age, but I think this sign is a lot more tyrannical than what is sometimes more modernly expressed.

[Jim Eshelman]

I'm not completely sure where you are seeing Mars in Sagittarius. I think where it's coming from is that you are seeing the side that is ambitious and relentless. This is basic to the Sagittarian nature, but perhaps, Mars types will succeed in it best.

I'm comfortable sticking with the following summary of Mars in Sagittarius:

Social elitism, aristocracy. Excellence, quality. Higher & higher, ambition, travel. Judges self & others, may fail own standards. Right-wrong, reward-punishment, belief- & values-driven. Respects continuity of culture & social rituals. Preserves status quo, heritage, myth when possible. Loyal to tribe. Complacent affection.

Or this of Moon in Sagittarius:

Higher & higher (ambition, spiritual aspiration, flight). Optimism (adapting with positivism). Courteous, gracious, natural hosts. Seeks to impress (needs validation, approval). Devoted to ideals & values (political; nationalistic, tribal; loves history). Dramatic (actors). Mercenary. Strong family ties.

Or this of Mars in Sagittarius:

Idealist (not necessarily pragmatic). Serious about subjects of interest: sincere, devoted, studious (seems hardworking; it's really love or zeal). Passionate with beliefs; moral courage; persuasive. Innovative, ambitious, strategic. Thrives in classic styles. Many exude air of mystery or fantasy (branding?). Many are identified with ideologies, -ists, & -isms.

"Higher & higher" remains the most constant theme. One brings one's pesonal values to this, and berings one's capacities to achieving it. Depending on these, some Sagittarians are masters of compassion like Pope Francis. Some are are merciless suppressors of what they regard as inferior. It all depends on what they understand as "the top" or "the best," and what they have to bring to it.

[Soft Alpaca]

Not arguing any of that, in fact Jim your definitions of Saggitarius align with what is wrote in ancient Mesopotamian literate many years ago. Ie it's set in stone queit literally.

It come from an ancient.... bla bla bla... sags original name translates to chief of the ancestors.

That being said I see sag as more than just the human head. I see the animal head [the bite] the wings [the expansion] as well as the scorpion tail [possibly the unyielding nature] and the horse body [which denotes stubbornness and wealth/value] as integral parts of the sign as well.

I'm seeing Saggitarius as not only expansion [which is core of Jupiter] but also action [the core of Mars] and I see there are some vast differences between sag people and Jupiter people I think that in part.

I'm not sure there is a way I can even test for validity in this, however I believe that you are to kind in your words on sag Jim, however I know that your taking the idealized form of the signs. Ie the drunken tyranical aholes that abuse there wife kind of sag will not be shown.

[FlorencedeZ.]

In my opinion this is a fine example of a true Sagittarian.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=G3kKRhDx_Kc.

President of France
Emmanuel Macron
Born Dec 21 1977, 10:40 AM, Amiens, France

regards, Flo

[Veronica]

So I've come to realise that Saggitarius has duality, one side being that of a king (arrogant, stubborn, regal, dominant) the Other side being more mercenary like (ruthless, unyielding, power hungry

Wow.
Your definition of what a king is is mind blowing.
I would think that if a human being was like that, there would be no way the could ever become a king, and if he was born into being a king, the people would uprise against him because thats almost like the antithesis of why people have a king in the first place.

And your words for this mercenaryesque side you invision seems like synonymouns for your king.

[Soft Alpaca]

It's how I view authority. Kings are only fare and just in story books. Laws are made to proctet peopke, yet many may do equal harm as they do good. Even the holiest of men are people. People are animals and we all have a bestial side lying under the surface. That's partly why I don't like being in power, I am just a person and I don't trust that I would be able to control the high of being the top dog. I've seen or heard of many times where good men become consumed by it.

.....
The president was far more polite that I would have been.

I would have

A)ignored him (if he is uneducated then let him attack, he will make a fool of himself and future rebels will learn a thing or two rather than me waste my breath).

B)Encouraged him. Anyone has a right for the throne, as long as they are willing to do what it takes to get there

C)Got on his level. I'm not above him or anyone, sometimes it's best to play rough and fight dirty.

[Jupiter Sets at Dawn]

I'm sorry but how you "view authority" and define terms is not how most people do, and trying to force the rest of the world to use your definitions is rude. Please, next time, just get a dictionary. We are not obligated to learn your language. If you want to communicate, you need to stop trying to twist other people's words around to suit your idea of what they mean.

[Veronica]

"Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate. Our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. It is our light, not our darkness that most frightens us. We ask ourselves, Who am I to be brilliant, gorgeous, talented, and fabulous? Actually, who are you not to be? You are a child of God. Your playing small does not serve the world. There is nothing enlightened about shrinking so that other people will not feel insecure around you. We are all meant to shine, as children do. We were born to make manifest the glory of God that is within us. It is not just in some of us; it is in everyone and as we let our own light shine, we unconsciously give others permission to do the same. As we are liberated from our own fear, our presence automatically liberates others." Marianne Williamson

[Soft Alpaca]

I understand were both of you are comming from. I apologize for not defining things. The dictionary definition of a king is

"the male ruler of an independent state, especially one who inherits the position by right of birth."

Everything else is our own experince, including both seeing kings as tyrannical and as good/ God fearing.

I may be guilty, however none of us are innocent.
.......

I love the idea of God(s) and I see why you brought up what you did. However I'm fine belittling myself, because sometimes it gets me further. It makes me more likeable and more humble both of which I could work on. I'm not about to push others down and do not expect them to do so either.

By the sounds of it im appearing more and more Saturnine to you other guys on Solunars.

[Danica]

"Our deepest fear is not that we are inadequate. Our deepest fear is that we are powerful beyond measure. It is our light, not our darkness that most frightens us. We ask ourselves, Who am I to be brilliant, gorgeous, talented, and fabulous? Actually, who are you not to be? You are a child of God. Your playing small does not serve the world. There is nothing enlightened about shrinking so that other people will not feel insecure around you. We are all meant to shine, as children do. We were born to make manifest the glory of God that is within us. It is not just in some of us; it is in everyone and as we let our own light shine, we unconsciously give others permission to do the same. As we are liberated from our own fear, our presence automatically liberates others." Marianne Williamson

I love this. Thank you.

[Veronica]

I love YOU sweetheart! Your bright light inpires me to get my head outa the dark places. Its my pleasure to share gems that have been shared with me.