Angular Mercury project

[Jim Eshelman]

I want to invite you to join in an investigation of natal planetary angularity similar to the projects we undertook for Sun, Moon, and Mars signs. I suggest we spend two weeks on each planet.

Welcome first, then, to the Angular Mercury discussion project, which will run January 26 - February 12, 2021 (and then will remain around in case people want to revisit it in the future). Please gather your list of Mercury Angular people (especially those you know personally) and join us.

CRITERA: For this study, let's stick to planets within 7° of major angles (Asc-Dsc, MC-IC) and 2° of minor angles (Zenith-Nadir, EP-WP). Ideally (i.e., if you can), please assess proximity to horizon and meridian in prime vertical longitude, squares to MC and Asc in longitude, and RA contact to EP and WP in right ascension.

Here is the primary Angular Mercury interpretive resource on the forum:
viewtopic.php?f=15&t=38#p184

We may also want to compare to Sun in Virgo and Sun in Gemini for ideas to check against our Angular Mercury examples:
viewtopic.php?f=13&t=35#p157
viewtopic.php?f=13&t=35#p160

My current concise summary of Angular Mercury (always subject to change) reads:

Alert, attentive, observant, strategic, analytic. Mentally sharp, hard to fool (knows more about you than you think). Little emotional affect, hard to read. Nervous (anxiety? worry? touchy?). Easily bored without regular mental stimulation. Good at precise, detailed work; naturals at handling business. Curiosity drives sexual choices as much as any other factor.

[Jim Eshelman]

On the angular Mercury interpretation page are a couple of observations that don't fit into concise, bullet-point type notes. Here they are for your consideration:

A large percentage of angular Mercury people I know are surprisingly easy to offend. Their response isn't to become overtly emotionally reactive so much as just to vanish. I'm still trying to put my finger on the exact mechanism here. A few (not the majority) are just plain touchy. Most seem offended primarily at the idea that someone got a fact wrong about them, and aren't necessarily emotionally sensitive to the remark. Most are just plain hard to read about whether they are kidding, offended, or unaffected (very little emotional affect, thus limited data on how they are reacting to something). Still looking at this one.

Quite a number of the most successful professional pop musicians (and some other similar entertainers) have foreground Mercury. Given their commercial success, I'm inclined to think it just shows keen business acumen. The group includes names like Madonna, Michael Jackson, John Lennon, Paul McCartney, George Harrison, comedians of the like of Johnny 7Carson and Robin Williams, directors who know the business as well as Clint Eastwood and Robert Altman, as well as straight commercial figures like Rupert Murdoch and Ted Turner. (These are just a few, but they're quite representative.) UPDATE: The four most obvious general business leaders with angular Mercury are Murdoch, Turner, Bill Gates, and Lee Iacocca, marking communications media, transportation, and computers.

[Jim Eshelman]

People active on this forum with Mercury angular include:

• sotonye
• Parto
• StarAgeWiz
• Venus Daily

Some famous people with Mercury angular:

• Adolf Hitler, Charles Manson, John Wayne Gacey, Valerie Solanas, Ted Bundy
• Queen Elizabeth I, Queen Victoria, King Edward VIII (Duke of Windsor), Prince Charles, Princess Diana, Camilla Parker-Bowles, Marie Antoinette
• George Washington, Woodrow Wilson, Ronald Reagan, George W. Bush, Hillary Clinton, J. Edgar Hoover
• John Lennon, Paul McCartney, George Harrison, Madonna, Prince, Phil Spector
• Bill Gates, Lee Iacocca, Rupert Murdoch, Ted Turner
• Israel Regardie, Manly Palmer Hall
• Malcom X, Rodney King, Michel Gauquelin, Valerie Harper, Johnny Carson, Robin Williams, Woody Allen, Clint Eastwood

[Soft Alpaca]

I'm out (my mercury is far to Mars influenced anyway) their on the slightly angular mercury here, but I want to note the idea of magick (the study) is gaining knowledge at it's base core (exactly what mercury does). Then, theroically a "font" of magick may look like pistons firing through a collection of knowledge, possibly threads (get where I'm going here?). It's just like the nerves of our own bodies sending pulses to our brain- which is exactly how mercury angular people come across to me in person (like a nerve plus to the brain- which can go many ways....)

[Parto]

Low emotional affect. Most of the time you don't have a clue what's really going on with them. Informational communication comes far more easily to them than emotional communication.

Very true. Even when the need arises for emotional communication, (a) it still remains informational in form, unless there's a serious reason for it to be otherwise, and (b) it takes some effort (it was harder before, with less maturity and being less used to it). I've also sometimes seemingly compensated for this by oversharing emotional content.

Most seem offended primarily at the idea that someone got a fact wrong about them, and aren't necessarily emotionally sensitive to the remark.

Yes. Ironically, mostly caused by not self-disclosing, i.e., people don't have nearly enough information to judge me on, so they can't do it correctly. However, I find it difficult to see how there'd be offense without an element of emotion.

Garth Allen's observations on the "Mercury personality" are strikingly accurate for myself. I have a very youthful physical appearance for my age, with a small hint of androgyny (mostly on the face). I move quite fast. People sometimes may expect to see me in a particular direction from them and find that I'm already elsewhere. Kind of an unintentional (generally), whole-body "sleight of hand." I also tend to talk fast if following a spontaneous train of thought and if not picking my words much. I know how to slow down, but I had to make a point of learning to do so.

I identify nearly exactly with the summary for angular Mercury. Of the standard written interpretations for the factors in my chart, none is more on point than this one (a couple of others are equally so).

[Jim Eshelman]

BTW, I'm not going to jump in early on these since I think I've had the "first say" at the top. Some of the planet angularities I've rewritten top-to-bottom in the last couple of years (revetting statements against people's horoscopes) and I think they're in good shape - Mercury is one of these, but we're going to go through all 10 anyway. (And this way I get the benefit of your observations even when I think I've already "nailed" the main points.)

Besides the famous people listed above, I have a list of 27 people I knew/know sufficiently well with Mercury angular by the above criteria. I'll be rechecking against these 27. (Some of them overlap with the famous above: Israel Regardie, Michel Gauquelin, Manly Palmer Hall, Bill Gates, Valerie Harper. Most are private acquaintances, including my wife, my sister, my sister-in-law, a few of you on this site, and other friends of past and present.)

In some ways, it's hard for me to filter out some things on Mercury traits because Mercury is so important and personal to me. That means that, even among non-Mercurial people, my interaction and exposure to folks is going to lean toward "more Mercury" in the interaction.

[Soft Alpaca]

I think this would simply sum up what I'm trying to say.
"(Hyper) stimulating people".
As an outsider look mind you (you write from a very mercury point of view and may not realize this).

[Jim Eshelman]

As an outsider look mind you (you write from a very mercury point of view and may not realize this).

Yes, I do realize it: To me, that's the standard of education (and the one best suited for a forum framework where all we have to work with are our words).

However - this might be relevant to the discussion - though I'm mercurial in the sense that my Sun is in Virgo, my Mercury is background at birth, exactly in the middle of the 2nd house with its only aspect being its conjunction with Saturn. This shows the importance of the signs: Without them, I'd be (on paper) one of the least mercurial people you'll ever meet, and, as you say, I don't think that characterization is accurate.

[Soft Alpaca]

I'd say your stimulating at least in your conversation Jim (and in many ways I meant sexually, socially, academically etc.).

Mercury people always stimulate. I think that some of the Mercury angular people you pointed out also lead to stimulate good conversations on the forum as well (especially chiming in about the androgynous nature of the planet).

But as always I understand that our views can vary.

[Jim Eshelman]

I like to define the planets first through their physiological equivalencies and then through a set of fundamental needs that they represent. If one understands the fundamental needs thoroughly, other aspects of behavior seem obvious (natural consequences of those needs).

I see Mercury as related to the nervous system, including the brain (especially the forebrain, which houses most self-conscious aspects) and, of course, spinal tissues, sensory organs for input-output, etc. I think this ties into specific traits we attribute to Mercury and infers others.

Especially, though, I equate Mercury to INFORMATION NEEDS, which includes curiosity and the gaining and sharing (input and output) of information. When Mercury is angular, these needs are disproportionately strong in the person. I suspect that if you only know this one thing - that Mercury's angularity shows the strength of information needs including curiosity and the gaining and sharing of information - you can observe mercurial people and see the whole range of their basic traits.

From this, we expect a mercurial to be curious, perceptive, gathering, storing, interpreting, and sharing information.

[Parto]

[redacted]

[Jim Eshelman]

Garth Allen's observations on the "Mercury personality" are strikingly accurate for myself. I have a very youthful physical appearance for my age, with a small hint of androgyny (mostly on the face).

I didn't include in my summary because I can't confirm it sufficiently: I have a standard that a fact has to be confirmable in 70-80% of the people in my sample before I take it so. I'd like to think it's so, it fits my preconception of Mercury, but I can't match it to examples of physical appearance known to me.

It's a different matter with physical motion, though. Take Robin Williams, for example: He didn't grow up to look young at all EXCEPT his physical motion, his energy always felt young, even elfin. But not his actual physical appearance. Israel Regardie had a similar lanky mobility and energy, except for right after a surgery, but never had a youthful face as an adult. Valerie Harper had quick physical energy even sitting still. Bill Gates is very physically animated. Most that I know personally might, at most, have always been mistaken as a little younger than they are, but always looked fully adult. (The angular planet where my examples show looking consistently young, and nearly always much younger than their physical age, is Pluto.)

Among famous examples, the first to come to mind is Clint Eastwood, who is one of the great examples of someone who did NOT age gracefully (and doesn't care). McCartney and Ringo hold their boyishness plenty well, but they're both Geminis (and Ringo doesn't have an angular Mercury); and Johnny Carson stayed Libra-handsome (like other Libra men and women on my Mercury angular list). But other , "No, no, that person doesn't look physically young!" are Phil Spector, J. Edgar Hoover, Rupert Murdoch, and Woody Allen. And yet, several in particular have the wiry, nervous-bird like mannerisms that seem to have a speedy energy. (Strangely, Bill Gates is not like this.)

So... I have a hard time confirming this one in physical appearance but can easily confirm it in the energy. You went on to talk about physical speed: I see this in a few and it may be true of several more.

I also tend to talk fast if following a spontaneous train of thought and if not picking my words much. I know how to slow down, but I had to make a point of learning to do so.

Robin Williams, Wood Allen, Charles Manson, Paul McCartney, Regardie, etc.

[Jim Eshelman]

As for profession, one c an in a sense say that these people are prone to Mercury professions. More clearly, though, they are best represented simply as DOING BUSINESS, with many of the personal cases I know being outright entrepreneurs and/or self-employed - people whose actual business is "doing business." Among the famous, there are famous, highly successful examples of "businessmen," though my four best examples - Murdoch, Turner, Gates, Iacocca - just happen to be in the pristine Mercury-themed industries of news and other broadcasting, transportation, and computers.

Of the people I know best personally, there are some interesting examples of this "doing business" theme. I have several psychotherapists, for example. I'd always thought this was reasonably mercurial because what they do for a living is talk and analyze, with their subject matter being the mind. Until today, it had never occurred to me that (oh yeah!) they are also self-employed independent business people.

Of the others, I know, half are either in "general business" or self-involved in sales activities (MLM and direct sales in many cases). A few writers and an editor, though mostly doing other things as well. Then a mix of musicians, singers, and DJs, a commercial artist, a tech and design manager, a realtor, a couple of people in medical support fields, etc. There's enough of "Mercury fields" to make a case but the real common thread is "doing business" with an emphasis on self-employment and entrepreneurship.

[Jupiter Sets at Dawn]

Woman I know, Gemini Sun conj Venus, both widely opp Saturn works in beauty as she puts it, Moon in Libra; but Mercury most angular planet. She owns an electrolysis business working out of a beauty shop.

[Jim Eshelman]

[Jim Eshelman]

As a point of comparison, when I look at people (in the same sample set of a couple hundred people) who have Mercury on Vertex, Antivertex, Northpoint, and Southpoint, they do not have the traits we've been seeing in the angular Mercury set. (I'm looking at this anew - in passing - for each of the planets as we go.) The seeming exception in the set is Alfred Witte (Mercury on NP). There is one other personal example who is incredibly flexible with words and whose business involves flight. These, though, are the only clear exceptions.

In fact, if I were to draw any conclusion at all from the 18 examples, it would be that these are people who, even when able to handle data easily, go out of their way to give feeling a stronger voice. (Consider our own Veronica as one example.) There are examples of emotional health and EQ, as well as examples of emotional derangement, but "placing feeling ahead of intellect" - or, at least, "?don't let intellect and IQ out-trump feeling and EQ" - is the most consistent trait. Even the "words & flight" friend mentioned above holds that position. (The least psychologically healthy in the set seem quite willing to set sanity aside and take it out of the conversation.)

At the same time, I'm not sure the effect is strong enough to say it's consistent to the placement. (I'll be interested to see if I can a similar "suppressive" feel from this as we do the other planets.)

From the current data alone, I'd be forced to conclude that the Vertex-based set of angles has no value in terms of angularity or, if it has a meaning, it's the opposite of what's usually suggested.

[SteveS]

Feedback from my wife:
Asc: 25,07 Gem
Me: 25,19 Virgo

Jim wrote:

Prone to easy boredom without regular mental stimulation. (Most are careful to arrange their lives so that there is rarely a shortage of stimulation.)

(Bingo!!!) If not for Books and Facebook would die of boredom!

Courage of convictions. Speaks truth unhesitantly, even defiantly (as if advocating for the truth of the facts).

Bingo, Big time!

Business knack, entrepreneurial, oriented toward commerce; natural at "doing business," drives it by moving information and forging communication.

Nope

(Whatever their particular field, they probably are good at handling the business aspect of it.)

Yes

Nervous types, anxious, or worriers,

For sure!

Little emotional affect. Informational communication comes more easily to them than emotional communication. Gives few clues about what is really going on with them, how they really feel: Hard to read whether they are kidding, offended, or unaffected.

Very true.

Surprisingly easy to offend by getting a fact wrong about them. (It is an intellectual affront: They are not necessarily emotionally sensitive to it but take it seriously.) Rather than react to it emotionally, most just vanish.

Yep

Sense of humor is playful, geeky, clever.

Indeed.

Talented at precise, detailed work. Manually skilled, mechanical aptitude.

Extremely!

Curiosity drives their sexual choices as much as any other single factor; also, very skilled hands.

Maybe for their sexual choices. Very skilled hands

Most of those I know are surprisingly easy to offend, especially by someone getting a fact wrong about them:

Nope.
Fagan Firebrace:

Under this influence he imparts to others what he knows. According to his station in life he may, for example, preach sermons, give lectures, instruct others, or write, debate, criticize, discuss, or publish.

Nope
GARTH ALLEN on the MERCURY PERSONALITY (Kid Gloves)

“The most conspicuous trait of the individual whose natal Mercury is dominant is the youthful intentness of his mannerisms and overall appearance. He just doesn’t look at home in a rocking chair unless he is using it as an observation perch. His head shifts position from time to time, often with a jerk, in order not to miss a trick in the world around him. His eyes and face have a self-conscious motility reminiscent of bird behavior. Even in advanced age this aura of youngishness can be striking – the quick physical movement, the ballbearing sweep of the line of vision, the promptness of every response. At school, he seemed somewhat younger than the average of his classmates. His follicles have perseverance and he is apt to sport a head of hair when the pates of most of his friends have long since resembled billiard balls.

Mostly No.

“The speed of his physical reactions has a mental counterpart so that he tends to make up his mind on the spur of the moment and expresses himself as though he never feels the need to ponder a decision. Mercurians like to keep busy just for the sake of doing something as they are creatures to whom boredom can mean psychological disaster. They impress others as either temperamentally unstable or too susceptible to distraction to be reliable and this impression has cost many Mercurians a deserved promotion, or, for that matter, a job for which they are eminently suited.

Yep

Garth Allen (Kid Gloves)

…they are usually hypersensitive to pain,

(NO!)

…easily raise welts quickly when bruised or bitten by mosquitos, suffer cold and closeness earlier than others, and have poor resistance against skin ailments.

(Bingo)

Food & Skin allergies

(Bingo)

[Jim Eshelman]

Thanks, Steve! - One confusion: You gave opposite answers for the same trait worded slightly differently. Can you clarify, please?

Surprisingly easy to offend by getting a fact wrong about them. (It is an intellectual affront: They are not necessarily emotionally sensitive to it but take it seriously.) Rather than react to it emotionally, most just vanish.

Yep

And then:

Most of those I know are surprisingly easy to offend, especially by someone getting a fact wrong about them:

Nope.

[SteveS]

SteveS wrote: ↑Fri Jan 29, 2021 3:41 pm
Surprisingly easy to offend by getting a fact wrong about them. (It is an intellectual affront: They are not necessarily emotionally sensitive to it but take it seriously.) Rather than react to it emotionally, most just vanish.
Yep

Jim, I gave my wife a printout of your Mercury Angular (foreground) research and ask her to respond with her answers. She only meant to underline:

Rather than react to it emotionally, most just vanish.

Rather than the above complete paragraph which she mistakenly underlined. Meaning when she is confronted with any kind of personal “affront” she sidesteps it completely prompting her to answer: Yep (She’s a Libra)

[Parto]

Courage of convictions. Speaks truth unhesitantly, even defiantly (as if advocating for the truth of the facts).

Yes. "Courage" gave me pause. Maybe it's just that it doesn't strike me as a Mercurial word.

Sense of humor is playful, geeky, clever. (Often not their most noticed feature - they can seem so business-like - yet nearly always present on inspection.)

Yes!

[Jim Eshelman]

Courage of convictions. Speaks truth unhesitantly, even defiantly (as if advocating for the truth of the facts).

Yes. "Courage" gave me pause. Maybe it's just that it doesn't strike me as a Mercurial word.

Most astrologers don't realize that it is. Fagan pointed out that ancient astrologers commonly linked Mercury to bravery. I then noticed that the word "bravery," like "barbarian," comes from a root probably meaning "to babble."

Then, when Michel Gauquelin asked that I be provided with statistical printouts on his various character trait words mapped against Sidereal sign placements, for "courageous" all but one planet out through Mars spiked (to a statistically significant level) in either Gemini or Virgo. Priceless!

In truth, I'm sure "courage" is not quite the right word. It might be calculated, it might be a natural tendency to to the military, it might be that Mercury is indifferent to the issue of fear etc. However, the Gauquelin character trait words were all taken from articles and biographies showing how other people labelled his eminent professionals. This matches my observation that - whether it's really courage or not - people observing Mercurials, Geminis, and Virgos call them courageous.

[Parto]

[redacted]

[Jim Eshelman]

Nonetheless, "courage of convictions" describes most angular Mercuries, in my experience.

[Parto]

I'll never object to having courage associated with me.

Nervous types, anxious, or worriers, sometimes with substance abuse problems (alcohol or drug abuse, smoking, etc.). Nonetheless, many (perhaps half) are more physically calm.

Hadn't paid much attention to this item before. Interestingly accurate: despite inner nervouness or anxiety, physically it doesn't show, or at least not to the extent that would be expected for such an inner state. The sympathetic system itself may not be as active as expected, and/or I'll attenuate the outer expression more or less intentionally (I'm leaning on less).

[Jim Eshelman]

Does anyone else want to participate? (Abundant thanks to all who have already contributed.)

I'm satisfied with what has come out on this so far - it's let me tighten my Mercury angular interp (which was already close), so I'm thinking of moving on to Venus early (tomorrow) unless someone asks me to hold off so they can participate.

Thanks again.

[Parto]

[redacted]

[Jim Eshelman]

My slightly updated angular Mercury thumbnail summary is:

Alert, Curious, Realistic. Alert, attentive, curious, observant, strategic, analytic. Mentally sharp, hard to fool (knows more about you than you think). Youthful animation, keenness. Easily bored without mental stimulation. Knack for handling business (entrepreneurial). Good at detailed work. Nervous (anxiety? worry? touchy?). Little emotional affect, hard to read. Curiosity drives sexual choices.

The updated full interpretation is here as before:
viewtopic.php?f=15&t=38#p184

[SteveS]

Niece: mundo Mercury 2,22 conjunct Asc with Mercury eclipto partile 90 Pluto.

As a child growing-up-- known as the chatter-box, always chatting from the moment she woke-up. If she did not have someone to talk to, would talk to herself. Was a wiz student all throughout her schools, straight A’s /honor roll. I think her Pluto partile 90 her rising Mercury gifted her with a laser-like mental focus for studies and business career. Now a powerful businesswoman for a prominent local company. Her greatest asset is communicating with other business people acquiring financial clients for her company. Travels a lot visiting business clients. Last year voted businesswoman of the year in her community.

[TheScales_BothWays]

I know two people with Mercury angular (or at least, I know these two well enough to share what I can observe).

First is a guy I went on a date with back in August 2020, who I still talk to every now and then. He's a Scorpio-Libra with Mercury 2°24' conjunct MC (and 1°49' conjunct Zenith) - which is the stronger connection, btw?

Certainly a very Mercurial person. You might mistake him for being a Virgo. He loves reading books, novels and fiction, particularly - probably reads one every day. Watches a lot of series too. Also reads some manga/manhwa (the former is Japanese, latter is Korean) and watches some anime. He's quite hardworking, studious and knowledgeable (took a degree in biomedical sciences). You might ask him a question, not expecting him to know the answer either, but he'd instead actually answer it or make an educated guess about it. Certainly seems like someone you can't fool too. Doesn't seem to like being lazy. Also knowledgeable in social justice issues (could be a Libra Moon thing instead), and it's fun to talk about it with him. He's quite neat and tidy, doesn't like disorganised spaces. He also has a prominent androgynous or feminine side: wears make-up, learns and tries out new make-up techniques, has some flamboyant articles of clothing (his fashion sense is also much better than mine, could be his Libra Moon too, which probably also contributes to his femme side) and has a rainbow tattoo. He's got some sexual curiosities too, though I didn't ask him too much about them. His humour is indeed playful and geeky, and also a little phallic (guess the latter is his Scorpio Sun). He knows how to play the sitar/veena too.

Wouldn't say he's youthfully animated, though the only time I met him was in our date when we were just getting to know each other. He was rather chill and calm (maybe even had low emotional affect). But yes, he has keen eyes that look like they're observing or analysing something, even in pictures, combined with the Libra Moon eyes' signature stare. He doesn't look young or child-like either, he looks quite his age (early 20's). He is quite decently attractive though (might be his luminaries). Physically slim like a Virgo, but not too skinny. Later on, in text messages, I do sometimes sense a "nervous-y" energy from him every now and then. And this is where I notice the low emotional affect more noticeably, especially if we're texting after a while (days, weeks). I ask him questions about him to get to know him better, or I'd share something I've felt or been through and ask him "how about you?" but he doesn't seem to share a lot about himself, especially when compared to me I feel like (he also does have a Scorpio Sun, and that could be contributing).

Informational communication comes more easily than emotional communication. Gives few clues about what is really going on with them, how they feel

True. And he does seem to give some sort of a clue of how he feels.

Hard to read whether they are kidding, offended, or unaffected.

Kinda true, but using common sense to analyse the context seems to hit the mark.

Sexually, he doesn't seem to be as able to get aroused like I can (I share my feelings of being aroused or attracted to someone and he doesn't often relate to it), which I find kind of unusual since he's a Scorpio-Libra in his twenties, but it's no big deal of course. Maybe it's Mercury? He seems to suggest it could be his depression or trauma though.

Surprisingly easy to offend by getting a fact wrong about them. (It is an intellectual affront: They are not necessarily emotionally sensitive to it but take it seriously.)

There's this time where I asked him has he been drunk or have drunk any alcoholic beverages before. Then he shared about his experience being a little tipsy from drinking a glass of vodka. (And says he generally consumes alcohol moderately.) I was a little surprised, because I could've sworn that I remember asking him this same question months ago when I first knowing him, and he said he doesn't drink (while I was being honest that I do, occasionally). I told this to him and he said nope, I didn't say that I don't drink. Maybe I am indeed wrong, but it doesn't matter too much. He seemed quite defensive that I got this wrong about him, but not in an emotional way.

--------------------

Second, is my close friend from university. She's a Scorpio-Capricorn with Mercury conjunct IC 1°52' (and 1°22' conjunct Nadir). Again, which is the stronger connection?

She's the closest friend I have from university who knows I am gay (there are others who know too, but I'm not as close to them). I came out to her as gay, and later she came out to me as bisexual. I don't really notice her Mercurial side, though. Perhaps this could be a good example of the IC being the least outwardly expressive angle?

She's a great student, loves maths, and is quite hardworking in her studies, yes, but she doesn't often "come off" as a geek, even when she wears spectacles. She does have her geeky sides though, which she embraces. Loves going to the library: she says the university library is where she feels best to study or to just spend a whole day to relax and recharge (I wouldn't disagree, haha). Loves reading manga and watching anime, and she loves Yaoi. Loves playing games with the boys too, and likes other tomboy-ish nerdy things like cars and sports, but likes presenting feminine as well, when she likes to. She's also quite attracted to androgynous or butch women (as well as feminine and conventionally attractive women). She's quite sociable too, especially to men.

She definitely has the courage of convictions, but knows how to say it in an empathetic way. Being a Cap Moon, she knows when to say or confess something and when to rather just nod and withhold. Quite open about sharing her attractions and interests, and even a little bit of her bisexuality when other women in my country would probably not, at least not in front of men. She's quite curious to try out new, exciting things, and having as best the time of her life as she can. And yes, she can get quite bored without mental stimulation.

I wouldn't say she has low emotional affect, nor do I find her hard to read, but maybe it's because we're close friends. She does hides a lot of her own emotions though (her Scor-Cap luminaries are surely also responsible for this), but I understand and respect if she doesn't share it with me. She's also quite good at understanding how human emotions work and therefore can be quite empathetic and emotionally mature. Some may take advantage, but once they become too irritable or worse, they cross a line, she doesn't hesitate to stand her ground. She isn't someone to make a fool of either. As a Cap Moon, she just ignores you and leaves you behind if she finds you a negative influence in her life. She may still care about you, but she wouldn't pay attention to you. She's also quite observant and alert, but I don't really notice it from her eyes or her facial gestures.

Having been through enough relationships and breakups, she doesn't have much faith in romance anymore, and enjoys living the single life, but is still open to romance if things seem fit. Loves to other people being in loving relationships though, and wishes couples well.

She surely has a youthful and childlike side that comes every now and then in a charming way, especially when she's in high spirits, and when talking about her geeky interests, and can sometimes pose in a childlike way. She can walk as slowly as she likes, but usually walks fast, something she gotten used to, from being short and hanging around with taller guys.

I think I'll end here, since that is all I have got to say for now. Boy, isn't this quite a long post, lol.

[Jim Eshelman]

With Mars angular, I have tentatively observed that there may be a distinction between (what we might call) the active and passive poles of each angular axis in natal astrology, where the planet's needs are equally strong across all angles but the active end (Asc, MC, EP, maybe Z) has a more active identification and forthright, "in your face" expression, while the passive end (Dsc, IC, WP, maybe N) has less identification (maybe active disidentification), containment (with the IC: covert, hidden) as a layer. Something similar may be available with the angular Venus, too. Can I see anything similar with Mercury on each angle?

With so neutral a planet, this might be tougher to see. Let's take a look.

Mercury on MC examples I have are a strange group. Impressions immediately start rising when I look at the names but I'm not sure I want to say more than that there is great curiosity, which motivates a great range of parts of their lives. I can't really tell a difference (on quick inspection) from the Mercury on IC people except that Mercury on IC people are broadly private: Even if in the public's eye, they are private people (George Harrison, Woody Allen, Rupert Murdoch, and others have this privacy character.)

I have a huge list of Mercury rising people. Those that I know personally have all the usual listed Mercury traits (and, I now see, may have disproportionately affected my overall Mercury view). Hard to generalize, there is so much to say about them - so I'll just say they look like my standard Mercury angular paragraph. Of public figures, the traits obvious knowing someone personally are obvious, but they are all great communicators, widely written authors, voices that people listen to (from Ronald Reagan to Madonna), people (take Ted Turner) who created communication systems, authors who roll out one book after another. It's quite an obvious theme.

I also have a big list for Mercury setting. Is there a difference? Yes, for those I know personally the traits are quite there (they are curious, wired people etc.) but more private - they aren't as out front. They fulfill their form of expression quite fully but usually behind private office doors. However, among the famous, there is the same most obvious trait for Mercury rising - voices that people listen to! - no particular difference. In this "voices that catch the public's ear and attention" I include John Lennon, Phil Spector, Princess Diana, Lee Iacocca, Adolf Hitler (against the private, behind the scenes example of Charles Manson). - So the difference of public figures isn't obvious to me at all.

I only have too few Mercury EP and WP figures in front of me to draw any conclusions. Ibn Zenith-Nadir I at least see the interesting similarity and contrast of Queen Elizabeth II with Mercury at Zenith and Prince Charles with it on Nadir.