Venus-Neptune & shooting massacres

General Discussion on Mundane Astrology matters for which a specific forum does not exist.
Post Reply
User avatar
Jim Eshelman
Are You Sirius?
Posts: 19062
Joined: Sun May 07, 2017 12:40 pm

Venus-Neptune & shooting massacres

Post by Jim Eshelman »

Mar 06, 2016

In SMA I noticed early on that Venus-Neptune aspects were surprisingly common for shooting massacres. This is inconsistent with astrological tradition, but I had an inkling it was related to psychological factors in the adolescent and young adult shooters. I had accepted it as the distinctive form of afflicted Venus for this sort of event, but always felt a bit apologetic - I was pretty sure the examples were representative, but I couldn't easily pin down an exact justification, just a few vague intimations and key phrases.

The initial identified shootings are hardly minor or unrelated in style: Columbine, Sandy Hook, and the Aurora shootings stand out. Add to these the 2015 Colorado Springs shooting ,the San Bernardino massacre, the Overland Park Jewish Center shootings, the Murrysville school stabbings, and even such similar-but-distinctive events as the 2015 Paris attacks, the Benghazi attack, and the 1979 Grand Mosque seizure. We also have high profile individual murders, such as John Lennon's shooting, though in general the pattern is for massacres.

In working on the critical 10th version of SMA, I finally decided I had to do something to pin this down more substantially. I did some digging around, found various psychologists supporting my underlying theory, and in particular this excellent article in Scientific American http://www.scientificamerican.com/artic ... ly-dreams/

Here is part of the rewrite of the Aurora "Dark Knight" events discussing what I think is the real meaning of Venus-Neptune in such events. (I just realized when typing this that I didn't do justice to the "celebrity" angle, I might edit that in.)
Venus-Neptune aspects recur in other shooting massacres. Historically, astrologers have not linked this aspect to this kind of event. Probably the examples available all involve a certain character type, such as a pattern of disillusionment and social alienation. For example, in “Deadly Dreams: What Motivates School Shootings?” (Scientific America, August 1, 2007), Frank J, Roberts reported on research into routinely fantasy-driven “premeditated and choreographed” school shootings. Reading Roberts’ discussion makes these incidents seem, to me, as much like performance art as any other kind of event. He and his colleagues found that the shooters are motivated by violent adolescent fantasies that “take root in a desperate mind that yearns for recognition [and respect]”. Over time, these fantasies intensify, grow more detailed, and “often become buttressed by a distorted sense of what is just or moral, such as the need to avenge a perceived offense.” Although most people use fantasy in part as a psychological escape valve that helps equilibrate their psyches, a few people dive deeper into their increasingly elaborate fantasy worlds which become the frameworks within which they experience social interactions.

This seems deeply consistent with Venus-Neptune aspects. In any case, the available data requires us to accept this as a signature aspect for this category of event.
Jim Eshelman
www.jeshelman.com
User avatar
Jim Eshelman
Are You Sirius?
Posts: 19062
Joined: Sun May 07, 2017 12:40 pm

Re: Venus-Neptune & shooting massacres

Post by Jim Eshelman »

SteveS wrote:Jim, I do know this: Bradley in his book 'Solar & Lunar Returns' says this about Venus-Neptune symbolism:
Among all the planetary combinations, this is the proverbial "kiss of death,"...
Of course Bradley did not mean for us to take this literally with genethliacal astrology as someone dying, but it sure appears with SMA we have to allow people dying in the context of the mundane world. Bradley with his above words does single this aspect out from all aspects as to be interpreted with something to do with the "death" of something.
Jim Eshelman
www.jeshelman.com
User avatar
Jim Eshelman
Are You Sirius?
Posts: 19062
Joined: Sun May 07, 2017 12:40 pm

Re: Venus-Neptune & shooting massacres

Post by Jim Eshelman »

Bradley's use of "kiss of death" was primarily in the sense of "a sucker is born every minute." It's the kind of charm + deception that can sell a refrigerator to an Eskimo, to use the old phrase. In writing on it as a natal aspect, he spoke of a velvet touch, ingratiating manner that can melt others' resistance and doubts, the ability to weave a fascinating illusion of charms. In another place, he wrote that Venus-Neptune is "best recognizable for the way it endows the velvet touch, an ingratiating manner that can melt others' resistance and doubts so easily that Venus-Neptune has been called the kiss of death in planetary symbolism."

I think when he began using this phrase, he was heavily influenced by a cultural reference (as he was known to be - he often cited titles of '30s and '40s movies). In this case, the reference would be to the 1947 movie Kiss of Death, starring Victor Mature and Coleen Gray (and lots of up-and-comers like Richard Widmark, Karl Malden, etc.). The IMDB summary captures the flavor of the movie: "With his law-breaking lifestyle in the past, an ex-con, along with his family, attempt to start a new life, knowing a betrayed someone from the past is bound to see otherwise."

So when we see Bradley writing in 1950 with this phrase (and carrying it forward in decades following), I think we have to interpret it as, "like the movie Kiss of Death."
Jim Eshelman
www.jeshelman.com
User avatar
Jim Eshelman
Are You Sirius?
Posts: 19062
Joined: Sun May 07, 2017 12:40 pm

Re: Venus-Neptune & shooting massacres

Post by Jim Eshelman »

SteveS wrote:Yes, I understand Jim but with SMA Venus-Neptune is killing people. The only thing that makes sense is hysterical involving the loss of loved ones, but it would make more sense if Mars was involved for violence.
Jim Eshelman
www.jeshelman.com
User avatar
Jim Eshelman
Are You Sirius?
Posts: 19062
Joined: Sun May 07, 2017 12:40 pm

Re: Venus-Neptune & shooting massacres

Post by Jim Eshelman »

SteveS wrote:Yes, I understand Jim but with SMA Venus-Neptune is killing people. The only thing that makes sense is hysterical involving the loss of loved ones, but it would make more sense if Mars was involved for violence.
Read the first post above. I think it draws out a particular personality type that has been festering in malignant imagination and undergoing prolonged social humiliation leading to social alienation and a desire to live a grand video game ending and have vast celebrity for a while. (And that's only part of it.) These are all Venus-Neptune expressions. I think people who are living that reality get plucked by the cosmos to give expression to it.
Jim Eshelman
www.jeshelman.com
User avatar
Jim Eshelman
Are You Sirius?
Posts: 19062
Joined: Sun May 07, 2017 12:40 pm

Re: Venus-Neptune & shooting massacres

Post by Jim Eshelman »

Jupiter Sets At Dawn wrote:I agree with Jim. Killing as performance art, dreaming of fame and recognition, is a good description of these incidents, and fits the symbolism of the Venus-Neptune aspects perfectly. Mars would be necessary if these killings were the product of a sudden burst of anger, but they aren't. They're planned out in great detail, sometimes over the course of years, with every detail fantasized over. The perpetrators are playing the part of cold-blooded killer, unaffected by the emotional pleas of others. They even dress up for the part. That's not Mars.
Jim Eshelman
www.jeshelman.com
Post Reply