my Sunshine-Orion

[Veronica]

I think I have been neglecting the most important work in my life.
I recall telling my father at 15 when I ran away for the first time, that I didn't care if I was homeless as long as I had my son I would be happy. I knew I was going to have this boy even back then.
I fell down a rabbit hole this morning, self absorbed in my own transit that is so torturous (though self driven I know on many levels) for me.
my freedom loving nature hates to be bound, hates to be held down and a comment made about an afflicted chart and how there was really nothing to be done (undone?) and god only know why......made me think of my little buddy.
I dont want to be so bold as to say I know the moment of conception, but I do believe the moment his soul descended or arose (Im really not sure) I knew he was different.
my pregnancy was hard, I was taken out of work for a severe case of preeclampsia, I was in hard labor for almost 24 hours straight, with it stalling several times. at the end it was very much like he did not want to be born, and he somehow kept moving up and down my birth canal, like a yo yo. He was born with placenta previa, which is the placenta covering the opening of the cervics and instead of facing the front like most, he was twisted about and facing back.

all of my life descions since he has been born have centered around him, so much more so then my little girl. he is why I had my exhusband removed from the home, and he is why I stay home now, when I know I could be with the love of my life, I cant have Orion subjected to the men that Craig works with because I am afraid he would pick up and entrain with very destructive patterns that are already under the surface. Orion needs me and I need him and I have tried to protect him from outside dangers but he has internal issues that now as he is becoming a full grown man, I see need to be addressed and in some way shape or form illuminated and corrected/balanced.


Orion

January 16, 2001 11:41pm Rochester NY



I dont think moving him any where in the world would make any difference, ive played around with a few charts to see, but he is who he is and only the Creatrix knows for sure why, but maybe it was slap me awake and stop looking at my stupid head games. IDK

[SteveS]

Veronica, do you mind us peering into this time frame in your life with Orion's birth?

[Veronica]

not at all Steve, any and all insights and information is very appreciated.

I would very much like unbiasied interpretations, my boy isn't into the mystic much, but I do feel that if I gave a a rundown of his chart generated by someone other then his wild momma, he may be more inclined to be receptive to its helpfulness.

[SteveS]

First, I want to look at your "severe case of preeclampsia." My Nephew's wife a couple of years ago went through a severe case of preeclampsia and nearly died with very acute par-excellent symbolism in her Ennead chart.

[Veronica]

as I recall I was taken out of work around the beginning of November 2000, it was definitely before thanksgiving. slightly anemic, very very low blood pressure, water retention and I think I went from my normal slight 125ish to almost 175.

[SteveS]

My nephew's worst time with her preeclampsia occurred after delivery. They had to keep her turned upside down for 2 hours and it was touch and go if she would live. Was your worse times after delivery or before delivery?

[Veronica]

Most definitely before, I really don't recall any problems after except for pain and lots of blood. I did have trouble with the placenta and birthing it, but I had always attributed that to the hard labor and complete fatigue and my muscles being stretched to capacity.

[SteveS]

Veronica wrote:

as I recall I was taken out of work around the beginning of November 2000,

Since we don’t have a specific date to analysis, we should look at the current return charts beginning with the first week of November and transits for this time period. Your 0ct 29 2000 SLR (link below):
https://imgur.com/a/UvAiM32
Saturn is the most angular planet 1,05 cnj West Point, opposing your SLR (Natal) Moon. Natal Saturn close foreground SLR Dsc (Jim’s says: how we react to the SLR itself). So, a double whammy of angular Saturn in your Oct 29, 2000 SLR. On 9/11/2000 Saturn was stationed turning retrograde at 6,14 Tau, tightly opposing your Natal Moon-Neptune cnj. I suspect this is when you first started to feel the problems with preeclampsia, but it was really that double whammy of angular Saturn in your Oct 29, 2000 SLR which timed the culmination of preeclampsia problems.

Your current SSR (Sidereal Solar Return for 2000) shows a double whammy of Saturn. SSR Saturn partile 90 SSR MC, 5,00 cnj Dsc, and Natal Saturn partile cnj SSR West Point. Thank goodness for a 5 degree foreground Jupiter in your SSR on SSR Dsc.

[Veronica]

interesting....not to be crude but one of the things I recall was constipation and bowel issues. I had been a fairly strict vegetarian since about 16, but during the last trimester I did start eating some meat, because of the anemia and low blood pressure, which I found binding along with the iron supplements.

"Your current SSR (Sidereal Solar Return for 2000) "

? my current SSR, meaning right now?

[SteveS]

? my current SSR, meaning right now?

No, for 2000, forecasted some inhibiting Saturn for your 2000 solar year. Sorry about the confusion.

[Jim Eshelman]

I'm interested in the synastry between the two of you - what makes this bond so strong. The first thing I notice is your Venus on his IC (square your Uranus on his Asc). Your Sun also squares his Jupiter.

There is one particular sign of struggle: Your Saturn opposes his Mars and squares his Uranus. (He particularly doesn't take well to your controlling him or narrowing his options. But there is a lot of love and respect.)

When he was born, Uranus had just transited conjunct your Mercury and square your Saturn soon before. That is, during your pregnancy there were significant experiences or shifts in your psyche that shook your concrete foundation, opened up options where they were narrow, and awakened your mind to new things. You also had completed your Saturn return not long before, so your life opened to an entirely new chapter. Then, very soon before his birth, Jupiter square your Sun gave you some particular blessing; and it was just starting to oppose your Moon when he was born. In fact, your Sun/Moon longitudes average 6°25', and Jupiter at his birth was 6°33'.

Then, on the day of his birth, Mars semi-squared your Pluto - usually an indication of ferocious physicality or expenditure of energy, and much strain.

[Veronica]

Right before his birth was the only time in my life that I can say that my family reached out to me, showed concern and support and were there for me and let me know how important i was at holding and bringing the family together. Every single member of my family my dad included came to the hospital to be there. Thats a saturn influence....having your pop in your birthing room when you just want some privacy.

When my mother died in 96 the family drifted apart and no longer came togther for holidays or anything. I was the one who called tbem all, visited and tried to reorganize us.

It felt better then any material wealth having the people you love call you for a change

I know that i bought my home in June 2001 and my credit card limit was 100k. So i was also at that time feeling blessed that i had worked so hard for so long ecomonically that I could buy a home. (Eric thought buying a dodge viper was a better investment thrn my home has had dreams gallor of spending up my credit...which he did and no im SOL with no credit to even rent a place.)

[Veronica]

in my teens I started studying the environment and became concerned and active in organizations that I thought were going to be helpful in reversing what I saw as the rape of Gaia, ie. world wildlife fund, national wildlife federation, greenpeace ect. I also was keenly aware the number one issue with the world as I saw it was over population. I was doing my best to not contribute to this problem, and I did not want children, or to be more honest I knew that I was not going to have children with the man I was with at the time, I just knew he was not father material, or what I supposed father material was, even though he always said he wanted 3 kids, which he now has. during the last part of 98/99 I also had a major crisis of sorts because it was clear to me that this man had no intention of stopping his hardcore partying and sexual debauchery (as I saw it then). he wanted things that I was not prepared or willing to give to him sexually.


during the beginning of my relationship with Eric (oct.1 1999-) I had no innate feeling of wanting to have a child, I still was strongly against it, but he really sweettalked me with that forked tounge and once I found out I was pregnant, he kept on about what a great person i was and how I would be such a great mother. I knew he was right and I pushed aside my feeelings for the environment and allowed my self to do my best. i kinds justified it saying that I would raise a boy who wasnt like the other people who IMO had no respect for the planet and the animals, that I could have a son who would make a difference, with my guidance and love, he would not be a drunk addict abuser cheat and liar like all the rest of the people in my family.

"Your Saturn opposes his Mars and squares his Uranus"

he particularly does not is to put it mildy. never has, never will. he sees my restrictions as infringing on his will to spend his time as he sees it. wether its asking him to take the dogs out, or do the dishes or put his legos away. I know that he will always do what I ask, he will grumble about it, he wont do a very top notch job, but he will always do the small things that I ask, and I really dont ask that much. it hurts my feelings sometimes, and I have tried to be honest with him, that if he only could say things with love in his voice instead of the torturous groaning and moaning it would make things nicer for me. but my boy lives in a torturous state and I roll with it and use my tools to not take it personally.

[Veronica]

During my pregnancy, on june 13 (about a month before my wedding (july 16) my nephew who had just turned 16 was out drinking and driving and crashed, killing himself and two companions and the third was severely harmed.

It was a local tragedy. Huge media event with vigils and all the sorrows.

I went to the crash site as soon as i heard the news bc i knew his spirit was confused and lost. I went with a woman i had gotten to know just that past spring who was a Druid and a Shaman and a minister.

Encountering the spirit of my little dude and telling him he was dead was a profoundly mystical experience. We had a candle lit and when i told him.....the flame burst out and caught the memorial on fire burning the offering his beloveds had put out.

My friend really didnt know me at the time but she made it a point to let me know that I was a mother now and i cant be a Walker (as she called mystics who dealt w spirits) right now. That I had to leave the Maiden/wArrior path and walk the path of the Mother. That i had no business dealing with anything that would jepordize my child. That the path would be there for me when i was done and i could then resume my Work.

It was a big deal for me to push aside that part of me that danced under the moon naked and searched the woods for the GreenMan. I changed the way i spoke and prayed and opened myself up to just being in the moment and enjoying everything that being a mother was about. The puke/poop/sleepless nights and all.

I see my nephew in my son sometimes so clearly.
I have so many fears about failing as a mother, of something so tragic happening, out of my control(damn Saturn stuff) taking him away from me, i know deep down inside that im being foolish and that the love and life that is our dynamic synastry. Is allways there and to just be in the moment and be in love with the now.

I used to get so upset with Craigs hoards of people mixing with what i concidered my time with him. Never ever alone allways being pulled this way and that. In my mind, i went to visit him to be with him and to get that desirous feeling of being loved and loving in return. But always i wanted him to come and be with us and support me in my role as mother and not only see me as the maiden i used to be. Craig could have been a great father to my kids but I was swept up in some bs head games and lacked faith that i could actually rely on someone besides myself.

My little Dudes passing was a family tragedy that changed us all. It drove me to be able to focus on the real. The here and now. The physical and to just Know that all that spiritual mystical unity yoga good stuff and connections of bizarre synchronicity are always there but there is a time and place to give attention to things.

[Veronica]

I was looking into Orions midpoints today and rereading this this thread.
It appears as if his moon/Pluto midpoint is opposite his natal Saturn.

It was striking to me how Steve went into detail about Saturn during my pregnancy and the trouble with preeclampsia.

One of the traits I read for this aspect was "horribly deep repressions that came about as a means of survival"

As his care taker it brought a tear to my eye.because it would seem like this aspect has been with him since before he was evenborn and as his mother I have it manifest in different degree but all do seem to be horrible in one way or another (issues in relationships with grandma. My dad. His dad. His sister. Even with Craig)

Ive always gone along with the popular notion that repressing things Espically emotions is unhealthy and counter productive ect.

I obviously dont want him having horrible repressions and would like to help him learn to deal with his overpowering emotions that i can feel under the surface.
He hates his father and has never wanted anything at all to with him no matter what kindness I say about Eric.

It mentions that this aspect is transforming and getting in touch with his deepest insecurities yet it seems like attempting to anything (talk journal work out)

I trust the universe knows better then I do about how to care for things yet as a mother I really am looking for inspiration on how to enhance this seemi gly hard aspect.

I was just really moved by this aspect that I can honestly say Ive seen since before he was even born. He is my sunshine and Id do everything I could to not get in the way of his own soul work which seems so much more painful and harder then any other chart ive personally known.

[Danica]

tr Uranus recently (April 2018) finished a two-yearish pass to his natal Sun.
And upcoming, will be going opp Moon and sq Neptune from May 2019, for about two years.

All the while, tr Neptune has been dancing on his Venus-Pluto square, from April 2017 onward, and is soon to be finished, leaves orb in mid-January 2019.

He's up for huge changes in all things Luna-related in his psyche and life. And this is simultaneously tr Ur to nat Neptune. Breaking free of old ties and attachments as a general theme. Exciting and liberating for him, that's sure, however challenging for you as parent.

[Veronica]

tr Uranus recently (April 2018) finished a two-yearish pass to his natal Sun.
And upcoming, will be going opp Moon and sq Neptune from May 2019, for about two years.

All the while, tr Neptune has been dancing on his Venus-Pluto square, from April 2017 onward, and is soon to be finished, leaves orb in mid-January 2019.

He's up for huge changes in all things Luna-related in his psyche and life. And this is simultaneously tr Ur to nat Neptune. Breaking free of old ties and attachments as a general theme. Exciting and liberating for him, that's sure, however challenging for you as parent.

Thanks Danica,
I can see this coming, and have felt some of the Luna like shifting in how he is acting and reacting with me and his sister, and espicially about how he has been feeling about deep issues with his father.
I appreciate you taking the time to share this and I will for sure keep this in mind when my heart string get pulled.

[Veronica]

Orion has continued bringing alcohol into our home and drinking even though I have told him I do not want to be around it.

This is of course my deepest fear, that he will be another mean abusive alcoholic and addict.

His chart with Moon Mars squared Mercury seems to agree.

He is not even the legal drinking age.

It's hard not to feel like a failure and to take this personally.

In relation to my own SSR, I feel that my initial gut response yesterday to finding out he was still disobeying my house rule, which was throwing the bottles outside and planning on telling him that I think he needs to move out on his own (he wasnt home, I haven't seen him yet).....seems to fit my SSR theme.

I dont know what to do. I dont know what to say.
I know from my past that I tried doing and saying everything under the sun to get my loved ones away from poisoning themselves, from passive suicidal behavior....and nothing I did made any difference.

My feminine nature inclines me to receive, to be a receiver to the Masculine giver. Yet, it feels like all that they can give is drunken behavior, and while it seems all fun and games and no harm done from the drinkers point of view, I know from experience that it really hurts everyone in the long run.

Orion spent his SSR in Dundin Fl, with his friends partying, so I am hoping that when this SSR starts mopping up this fall and setting up for his next SSR that something like a nice shocking solar arc sent with love from the Universe will remind him how loved and special and important life is.

[Jim Eshelman]

In addition to drinking, including bringing alcohol into the home against house rules - is he also getting drunk? (Not everybody who drinks gets drunk, and not everyone who gets inebriated gets problematically drunk. I'm asking to get a handle on what's going on with him.)

In any case, I do hear your concerns about the long-term impact of this on his life.

I don't have his birth data or I'd offer some astrological opinions.

[Jupiter Sets at Dawn]

Orion
January 16, 2001 11:41pm Rochester NY

[Veronica]

In addition to drinking, including bringing alcohol into the home against house rules - is he also getting drunk? (Not everybody who drinks gets drunk, and not everyone who gets inebriated gets problematically drunk. I'm asking to get a handle on what's going on with him.)

In any case, I do hear your concerns about the long-term impact of this on his life.

I don't have his birth data or I'd offer some astrological opinions.

I haven't seen him drunk, but he works nights, so I cant say, but by the sheer volume of empty containers and his BMI I would think he is getting very buzzed at least. He was dead drunk a few weeks ago when he didnt pick up his sister.

[Jim Eshelman]

I just took a look. My opinion is that you have a discipline problem on your hands. The best scenario is that he's just acting out for various age-appropriate reasons, but I think he has a bit more trouble ahead of him.

My estimation just from the chart: He's a double Rim. Of all 9 quadruplicity pairs, double Rims (as Bradley liked to say, and I've found to be true) get in trouble with themselves and others more than any other type. Capricorns tend to act out, feel the need to distinguish themselves with a bit attention-drawing of juvenile mischief. Capricorn-Libra isn't usually socially well-adapted (but can be popular with friends because of their "bad boy" behavior). Mars in Libra is even more socially anomalous and prone to trouble.

"Prone to trouble" doesn't mean he's bad or that he's headed over a cliff. Some acting out and getting in trouble is entirely age-appropriate, especially for his sign-types.

And Capricorns feel Saturn's choke easily so they tend to be resistant to discipline and rules. There are the usual father-identification matters - standing always in the shadow of his father or father figures, trying to forge his own autonomy and pride, which usually results in one of the three variations of striving to be his father, striving to one-up and 'better' his father, or striving to (usually figuratively, not literally) kill his father.

So, yes, there are discipline issues. I would not be an effective parent for him, so you probably don't want to listen to my advice on it very closely. It does seem that a balance has to be navigated between strictness and freedom. He does measure love in terms of firm guidelines and boundaries, but he measures hate in terms of that also. The chart is not pronouncedly alcoholism- or addition-prone - there's the Mercury-Mars square and some proneness from Mars in Libra, but that' not a lot compared to other charts. But there is a definite tendency to get in trouble and perhaps a strong streak of needing to get into serious trouble at least once to earn others' admiration, let him build his own pride of accomplishment (yes, from getting in serious trouble!), and confirm some measure of autonomy and effective self-governance.

[Jim Eshelman]

Right now, Uranus opposes his Mars by transit, so this is a year that - at the very least - he has to force his independence. Most often, people tend to need to break things under this (literally or figuratively), and, if not smack others around (figuratively) then at least startle them and make them feel slapped in the face.

Saturn conjoins his Neptune, so there are a few months of morose response to things, or his having a dark outlook on his world. (This squares his Moon, too. This is the worst aspect he has going. It seems to warrant psychological counseling or intervention in the "life adjustment" sense.)

Yes, for the short run (say, the rest of 2021) I now share your concern and sense that he needs significant help for a while.

[FlorencedeZ.]

My heart goes out to you Veronica.
I can really relate.
I think he needs you more then ever. At this age, keep the line open, discuss, talk, ask for his opinions.
Tell him you love him over and over again and hug.
And that he doesn't need alcohol as he is strong and capable.
Ask how he would do it if he had a child later on who drinks early.
Discuss what it does to his brain and that repair may not take place.
Mostly it is a phase and when they are more balanced, when the brain is full grown things will be more conscious.
My son also worked late nights and night shifts which is not good for that age.
When he stopped doing this and worked different hours it made a huge difference, he was much better and happier.
Hope this helps you a little bit, it defenitely will get better.

[SteveS]

Veronica, this 8 minute video may help your situation with Orion, I don’t know-- but can’t hurt the situation. Nikki Glaser swears Allen Carr’s book has helped many of her friends stop their drinking problems.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9LUm51Z-Ii0

[Veronica]

Great video Steve, had to watch it twice to get the name and author. Alan Carr the Easy Way to Stop Drinking. published 2005.
Seems that the book has limited availability and a hardcover can cost around $80! That's a discouraging price.

Orion listens to this Joe fella, I hear his voice in the house often. I've been perking my ears up to try and grok Joe's Point of view on things and if he is someone Orion should be listening to for advice.

I will look more into that author and his books to see if there are more reasonable prices options. Very sad to see that a book that sounds so very helpful is outrageously priced.
but...did you know....that certain companies buy books just to destroy them? The tobacco and alcohol business are notoriously known in publishing to buy out books that go against thier product so the information about thier negative health effect does not get into the normal Joe's hand. they take away the supply, the demand is high, so the price rises to something stupid like 80 for a cheaply manufactured hardcover.

[SteveS]

I had no idea the cost of the book was 80 $. Maybe do a search for a possible used cover? If Orion likes Joe, you have a better chance to get him to listen. Joe is OK, I have learned tons of stuff listening to his Pod Casts which has improved qualities of my life---very educational stuff--cutting edge!

[Jim Eshelman]

Veronica, I don't know the Carr books, but here is another by him on the same topic - Kindle version $8, paperback $13.
https://www.amazon.com/Allen-Carrs-Drin ... 07G15XHQW/

[Veronica]

Thank you Jim for those most insightful words.

I am worried with my SSR that something horrible would happen to him specifically. And the whole Uranus transit reminds me of all his death run ins that gave me hartattacks before....falling off a water fall, having an arrow go through his hand, .......and he now wants to get a motorcycle!!!!

I dont know if men really understand how hard it is for moms to raise boys, and the fears we have for them specifically.

[Veronica]

My heart goes out to you Veronica.
I can really relate.
I think he needs you more then ever. At this age, keep the line open, discuss, talk, ask for his opinions.
Tell him you love him over and over again and hug.
And that he doesn't need alcohol as he is strong and capable.
Ask how he would do it if he had a child later on who drinks early.
Discuss what it does to his brain and that repair may not take place.
Mostly it is a phase and when they are more balanced, when the brain is full grown things will be more conscious.
My son also worked late nights and night shifts which is not good for that age.
When he stopped doing this and worked different hours it made a huge difference, he was much better and happier.
Hope this helps you a little bit, it defenitely will get better.

Thank you so much for this Flo!
we had a very healthy conversation last night, and I was able to express my concerns and fears as well as my disappointment in his breaking my rule, straight forward very intellectually without being emotionally reactive.

My main point to him was how much I love him and our life and our relationship, but from my experience I have seen people I love and cherish and who love me, turn on a dime when drinking, unleashing pent up feelings and thoughts and violence from issues they would not address sober.

I told him that was my biggest fear with him drinking, besides the damage to the brain and heart, was that he was harboring negative feelings and that he too would unleash them at me. I told him that it's normal to have feelings arise in us like anger and displeasure but that we have to find a healthy way to express them in the moment when we feel them and not bottle them up inside.

to which he got all teary eyed, which I told him was a perfect expression of feelings and a very appropriate and healing way to let them out.

[Veronica]

Veronica, I don't know the Carr books, but here is another by him on the same topic - Kindle version $8, paperback $13.
https://www.amazon.com/Allen-Carrs-Drin ... 07G15XHQW/

Great!! Thank you!!
I only checked quick this morning, I have a interview at a library in the Finger Lakes I have to get to soon and was going to shop around when I got home.

[SteveS]

V wrote:

I dont know if men really understand how hard it is for moms to raise boys, and the fears we have for them specifically.

The toughest job/task in this convoluted world we are living in---is being a mom raising children.

[mikestar13]

`Orion's nativity, per Astro 0.2:

Code: Select all

 +-------------20Cn58-----------23Ge04-----------23Ta51--------------+
 |                |                |                |                |
 |                |                |                |                |
 |                |                |                |                |
 |                |                |                |                |
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 |                |                |                |                |
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 |                |                |                |Ju 06Ta33 13°00'|
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 |                |                |                |                |
 |                |                |                |                |
 |                |                |                |Sa 29Ar22 05°42'|
 |                |                |                |                |
 |                |                |                |                |
 19Le32-----------+----------------+----------------+-----------22Ar25
 |                |                                 |                |
 |                |                                 |                |
 |                |                                 |                |
 |                |                                 |                |
 |                |              Orion              |   Vx 12Ar04    |
 |                |                                 |                |
 |                |              Natal              |                |
 |                |                                 |                |
 |                |    16 Jan 2001 23:41:00 EST     |                |
 |                |                                 |                |
 |                |        Rochester, NY USA        |                |
 |                |                                 |                |
 |                |      43N09'26" 077W36'55"       |                |
 |                |                                 |                |
 |                |          UT 04:41:001           |                |
 20Vi12-----------+                                 +-----------20Pi12
 |                |         RAMC 109°18'29"         |                |
 |                |                                 |Er 24Pi05 28°07'|
 |   Ep 26Vi09    |          OE 23°26'18"           |                |
 |                |                                 |                |
 |                |         SVP 05Pi14'58"          |                |
 |                |                                 |                |
 |                |         Sidereal Zodiac         |                |
 |                |                                 |                |
 |Mo 10Li30 17°04'|         Campanus Houses         |                |
 |                |                                 |                |
 |                |         A from Veronica         |                |
 |                |                                 |                |
 |                |                                 |                |
 |Ma 19Li32 26°52'|                                 |                |
 |                |                                 |                |
 22Li25-----------+----------------+----------------+-----------19Aq32
 |                |                |                |Ve 19Aq28 29°53'|
 |                |                |                |                |
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 |                |                |                |                |
 |                |                |Su 02Cp23 09°57'|                |
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 |                |                |                |                |
 |                |                |Ne 11Cp10 19°25'|                |
 |                |                |                |                |
 |Pl 19Sc33 22°20'|                |                |                |
 |                |                |Me 16Cp14 24°51'|                |
 |                |                |                |Ur 24Cp44 03°59'|
 |                |                |                |                |
 +-------------23Sc51-----------23Sg04-----------20Cp58--------------+


------------------------------------------------------------------------
Pl Longitude   Lat   Speed    RA    Decl    Azi     Alt     PVL    Ang G
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Mo 10Li29'57" 04N59 +12°59' 214°38' 08S34  85°48' -17°01'  17°04'  64%  
Su 02Cp22'56" 00N00 + 1°01' 299°11' 20S44 336°40' -66°06'  99°57'  75% F
Me 16Cp14'18" 01S45 + 1°38' 313°57' 19S09 311°28' -58°18' 114°51'  50%  
Ve 19Aq28'30" 00S14 + 1°01' 345°34' 06S26 289°42' -28°38' 149°53'   0% B
Ma 19Li32'12" 01N12 + 0°34' 222°12' 14S59  85°36' -26°48'  26°52'  47%  
Ju 06Ta33'08" 00S45 - 0°02'  59°20' 19N42 256°51' +42°14' 223°00'  19% B
Sa 29Ar22'00" 02S08 - 0°01'  52°17' 16N44 259°40' +35°16' 215°42'  32%  
Ur 24Cp44'22" 00S41 + 0°03' 322°08' 15S37 304°23' -50°46' 123°59'  35%  
Ne 11Cp10'09" 00N10 + 0°02' 308°15' 18S38 321°01' -60°44' 109°25'  60%  
Pl 19Sc33'16" 10N21 + 0°02' 254°12' 12S14  55°06' -46°44'  52°20'   4% B
Er 24Pi05'02" 15S22 + 0°00'  23°11' 06S51 262°21' - 1°52' 178°07'  99% F
------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Class 1 Aspects          Class 2 Aspects         Class 3 Aspects     
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Mo sq  Ne 00°40'  99%    Mo sq  Me 05°44'  39%     Mo co  Ma 09°02'  17%
Me sq  Ma 02°01'  92% M  Su tr  Ju 04°10'  67%     Su oc  Ve 02°06'  49%
Ve tr  Ma 00°04' 100%    Su tr  Sa 03°01'  83%     Su co  Ne 08°47'  21%
Ve sq  Pl 00°05' 100%    Me co  Ne 05°04'  72%     Su oc  Pl 02°10'  45%
Sa sq  Ur 01°44'  94% M  Me sx  Pl 03°19'  79%     Me co  Ur 08°30'  26%
Ur sx  Er 00°39'  99%    Ma sq  Ur 05°12'  50%     Ma op  Sa 09°50'   3%
                         Ju tr  Ne 04°37'  60%     Ju co  Sa 07°11'  46%
                         Ur sx  Pl 05°11'  50%     Ju oc  Er 02°32'  27%
                         Pl tr  Er 04°32'  61%                          
------------------------------------------------------------------------

Is Chaos his middle name? Eris is by far his angular planet only 1°53' from the descendant in prime vertical longitude, with a partile sextile to Uranus and a class 2 trine to Pluto.

His Capricorn Sun is widely foreground and has no class 1 aspects, but class 2 trines to Jupiter and Saturn, with Saturn the more prominent by orb. He is somewhat strong-willed, but he both experiences a sense of limitation and pushes back against it. This is enhanced by Jupiter being background and therefor "struggling to get out", mainly via the sun trine.

I find deeply background Venus (only 7' PVL from the sixth cusp) very concerning, most especially with the partile square to Pluto and partile trine to Mars. All made more significant by his Libra Moon. Are you familiar with the Juice Newton song Love's Been a Little Bit Hard on Me? I fear love has been and/or will be a lot hard on Orion.

Blessings on the both of your and guidance toward the right path.

[Jim Eshelman]

It's soooo easy to see the important stuff in a chart with your emerging program.

Waiting for 0.2 to emerge

[SteveS]

Jim wrote:

Right now, Uranus is opposing his Mars by transit, so this is a year that - at the very least - he has to force his independence. Most often, people tend to need to break things under this, and if not smack others around (figuratively) then at least startle them and make them feel slapped in the face. There's a need to break something or other (literally or figuratively).

Veronica wrote in response to Jim’s above words:

And the whole Uranus transit reminds me of all his death run ins that gave me hartattacks before....falling off a water fall, having an arrow go through his hand, .......and he now wants to get a motorcycle!!!!

Veronica, you have seen me post many times how important Robert Hand deemed Direct Midpoints, particularly the ones involving the personal points. I note in Orion’s chart a Direct Midpoint of Pl/Asc = Ma which Ebertin from COSI says about its tones:

Foolhardiness and daring, tendency to expose oneself to danger. Injury, accident.

Remember Veronica, these are Ebertin’s tones—not a forecast that these tones will actually manifest into a malefic event. Does Orion know you are into astrology? Is there any way you think you can get Orion to read Jim’s and Ebertin’s above words from a concerned loving Mother? It may help, but you as a Mother knows best. I will have more of my observations later on a lighter side.

[SteveS]

Mike wrote:

I find deeply background Venus (only 7' PVL from the sixth cusp) very concerning, most especially with the partile square to Pluto and partile trine to Mars. All made more significant by his Libra Moon. Are you familiar with the Juice Newton song Love's Been a Little Bit Hard on Me? I fear love has been and/or will be a lot hard on Orion.

Veronica, I think Mike with his above words nails a main theme intertwined into Orion’s life. I use the Moon’s Node in my work and we can see here with Orion’s Chart (link below), the partile grand trine of Venus-Mars-Node, with Node 7 minutes conjunct the Zenith. This puts a prominent emphasis on the tones from Ebertin about The Dragon’s Head (Node):

Associations or alliance

And we can see with Orion’s partile aspects he experiences a strong influence of Venus-Mars-Pluto through his associations in life. And as Mike pointed out Moon in Libra places more emphasis on love type relationships. With his Moon partile 90 Neptune—Neptune influences will color his relationships.
Orion’s Natal Chart:
https://ibb.co/c2BCbYK

[Veronica]

V wrote:

I dont know if men really understand how hard it is for moms to raise boys, and the fears we have for them specifically.

The toughest job/task in this convoluted world we are living in---is being a mom raising children.

Thank you for saying so.

It is just amazing to me that as hard as it is we are still surviving. My life as it is as a mother is achingly familiar to millions upon millions of mothers throughout time struggling to keep our children alive and healthy and happy.

I use every resource I know and ask for help when I need it, non stop. Must be pretty annoying actually to hear about. I know I get a little edgy with some of the moms I know about the struggle and how how strong a woman is.

But I dont agree with that.

I am a human being.
and I am a conglomerate of feminine and masculine.
Humans are not exclusively 100% all boy or girl, that is not possible and unnatural. We are a blending of both.
So yea while I have female sexual reproductive parts and seem all girly I have masculine testosterone in spades (or is that Scorpio) as well.
When I parent my kids I try to always be in that balanced mindset of my personal combination of femininity and masculinity. but that is hard when you get upset and the blood stops flowing to your prefrontal cortex and you cant think straight in the heat of the moment.

Parenting is the hardest job.
parenting as a team of balanced humans, is the hardest job.
That's why it isn't being done anymore.
It's too hard, and people at heart are masters of energy conservation and dont see the pay out in the long for the time and effort.

Being a father in my opinion is harder.
Men have to grow away from their childhood friends and keep all that outside influence away from his family so they can thrive. an insidious non stop task, and there is no one to vent or share or get suggestions because cultures teaches man that he cant ask for help or complain.

[Veronica]

`Orion's nativity, per Astro 0.2:

Code: Select all

 +-------------20Cn58-----------23Ge04-----------23Ta51--------------+
 |                |                |                |                |
 |                |                |                |                |
 |                |                |                |                |
 |                |                |                |                |
 |                |                |                |                |
 |                |                |                |                |
 |                |                |                |                |
 |                |                |                |                |
 |                |                |                |Ju 06Ta33 13°00'|
 |                |                |                |                |
 |                |                |                |                |
 |                |                |                |                |
 |                |                |                |Sa 29Ar22 05°42'|
 |                |                |                |                |
 |                |                |                |                |
 19Le32-----------+----------------+----------------+-----------22Ar25
 |                |                                 |                |
 |                |                                 |                |
 |                |                                 |                |
 |                |                                 |                |
 |                |              Orion              |   Vx 12Ar04    |
 |                |                                 |                |
 |                |              Natal              |                |
 |                |                                 |                |
 |                |    16 Jan 2001 23:41:00 EST     |                |
 |                |                                 |                |
 |                |        Rochester, NY USA        |                |
 |                |                                 |                |
 |                |      43N09'26" 077W36'55"       |                |
 |                |                                 |                |
 |                |          UT 04:41:001           |                |
 20Vi12-----------+                                 +-----------20Pi12
 |                |         RAMC 109°18'29"         |                |
 |                |                                 |Er 24Pi05 28°07'|
 |   Ep 26Vi09    |          OE 23°26'18"           |                |
 |                |                                 |                |
 |                |         SVP 05Pi14'58"          |                |
 |                |                                 |                |
 |                |         Sidereal Zodiac         |                |
 |                |                                 |                |
 |Mo 10Li30 17°04'|         Campanus Houses         |                |
 |                |                                 |                |
 |                |         A from Veronica         |                |
 |                |                                 |                |
 |                |                                 |                |
 |Ma 19Li32 26°52'|                                 |                |
 |                |                                 |                |
 22Li25-----------+----------------+----------------+-----------19Aq32
 |                |                |                |Ve 19Aq28 29°53'|
 |                |                |                |                |
 |                |                |                |                |
 |                |                |                |                |
 |                |                |Su 02Cp23 09°57'|                |
 |                |                |                |                |
 |                |                |                |                |
 |                |                |                |                |
 |                |                |                |                |
 |                |                |Ne 11Cp10 19°25'|                |
 |                |                |                |                |
 |Pl 19Sc33 22°20'|                |                |                |
 |                |                |Me 16Cp14 24°51'|                |
 |                |                |                |Ur 24Cp44 03°59'|
 |                |                |                |                |
 +-------------23Sc51-----------23Sg04-----------20Cp58--------------+


------------------------------------------------------------------------
Pl Longitude   Lat   Speed    RA    Decl    Azi     Alt     PVL    Ang G
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Mo 10Li29'57" 04N59 +12°59' 214°38' 08S34  85°48' -17°01'  17°04'  64%  
Su 02Cp22'56" 00N00 + 1°01' 299°11' 20S44 336°40' -66°06'  99°57'  75% F
Me 16Cp14'18" 01S45 + 1°38' 313°57' 19S09 311°28' -58°18' 114°51'  50%  
Ve 19Aq28'30" 00S14 + 1°01' 345°34' 06S26 289°42' -28°38' 149°53'   0% B
Ma 19Li32'12" 01N12 + 0°34' 222°12' 14S59  85°36' -26°48'  26°52'  47%  
Ju 06Ta33'08" 00S45 - 0°02'  59°20' 19N42 256°51' +42°14' 223°00'  19% B
Sa 29Ar22'00" 02S08 - 0°01'  52°17' 16N44 259°40' +35°16' 215°42'  32%  
Ur 24Cp44'22" 00S41 + 0°03' 322°08' 15S37 304°23' -50°46' 123°59'  35%  
Ne 11Cp10'09" 00N10 + 0°02' 308°15' 18S38 321°01' -60°44' 109°25'  60%  
Pl 19Sc33'16" 10N21 + 0°02' 254°12' 12S14  55°06' -46°44'  52°20'   4% B
Er 24Pi05'02" 15S22 + 0°00'  23°11' 06S51 262°21' - 1°52' 178°07'  99% F
------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Class 1 Aspects          Class 2 Aspects         Class 3 Aspects     
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Mo sq  Ne 00°40'  99%    Mo sq  Me 05°44'  39%     Mo co  Ma 09°02'  17%
Me sq  Ma 02°01'  92% M  Su tr  Ju 04°10'  67%     Su oc  Ve 02°06'  49%
Ve tr  Ma 00°04' 100%    Su tr  Sa 03°01'  83%     Su co  Ne 08°47'  21%
Ve sq  Pl 00°05' 100%    Me co  Ne 05°04'  72%     Su oc  Pl 02°10'  45%
Sa sq  Ur 01°44'  94% M  Me sx  Pl 03°19'  79%     Me co  Ur 08°30'  26%
Ur sx  Er 00°39'  99%    Ma sq  Ur 05°12'  50%     Ma op  Sa 09°50'   3%
                         Ju tr  Ne 04°37'  60%     Ju co  Sa 07°11'  46%
                         Ur sx  Pl 05°11'  50%     Ju oc  Er 02°32'  27%
                         Pl tr  Er 04°32'  61%                          
------------------------------------------------------------------------

Is Chaos his middle name? Eris is by far his angular planet only 1°53' from the descendant in prime vertical longitude, with a partile sextile to Uranus and a class 2 trine to Pluto.

His Capricorn Sun is widely foreground and has no class 1 aspects, but class 2 trines to Jupiter and Saturn, with Saturn the more prominent by orb. He is somewhat strong-willed, but he both experiences a sense of limitation and pushes back against it. This is enhanced by Jupiter being background and therefor "struggling to get out", mainly via the sun trine.

I find deeply background Venus (only 7' PVL from the sixth cusp) very concerning, most especially with the partile square to Pluto and partile trine to Mars. All made more significant by his Libra Moon. Are you familiar with the Juice Newton song Love's Been a Little Bit Hard on Me? I fear love has been and/or will be a lot hard on Orion.

Blessings on the both of your and guidance toward the right path.

Thank you for his chart Mike!
You are pretty close guessing his middle name and his life so far!

As a mother one of your biggest fears is that your child is going to grow up Into a jerk. So many times watching the news about the horrors of humanity I will think, What if that was my child who just did something ugly? I know the feelings of despair and guilt my sister felt knowing her son had killed some.
And society just seems to be filled with wackos who just snap and make a big mess, I sure would be mortified if my children did something like that.

I hear what you saying about your concerns. His chart does have the potential to really Express some hard feelings and situations.

I try and give that chaos and tension a healthy outlet in the kitchen. He loves food and cooking and what usually happens is that he labors over cooking his perfect meal, only to have it fall to the ground.

I think though that I dont have to worry about him doing something mean and ugly, because he isn't sad or depressed or mopey. He plays video games with friends all over the world and he laughs all the time with them.