Dreyfus, Alfred. October 9, 1859, 3:00 PM LMT, Mulhouse, France (AA).
MacPherson, Aimee Semple. October 9, 1890, 5:00 PM LMT, Ingersoll, ON (B).
Lennon, John. October 9, 1940, 6:30 PM BST, Liverpool, England (A).
NOTE: Based on relocation to LA and events such as her death, I think MacPherson's correct time is 5:11 PM LMT.
BONUS CHARTS:
Jayne, Charles. October 9, 1911, 10:43 PM EST, Jenkintown, PA (A).
Oct 9: Alfred Dreyfus & Aimee Semple MacPherson (+ Beatle)
- Jim Eshelman
- Are You Sirius?
- Posts: 19068
- Joined: Sun May 07, 2017 12:40 pm
- Jim Eshelman
- Are You Sirius?
- Posts: 19068
- Joined: Sun May 07, 2017 12:40 pm
Re: Oct 9: Alfred Dreyfus & Aimee Semple MacPherson (+ Beatle)
Alfred Dreyfus' chart invites inquiry on the enormously important question of whether the horoscope for birth can foretell the gigantic themes of one's life, including something so severe, unique, and outstanding as being the center of a decade-long scandal of his government and victim of fraud-based persecution and humiliation. - Or, as Fagan insisted, do such events only show in the return charts and other timers later in life.
I have only gone so far in examining this. My first impression leads me to the usual soft-sell compromise often espoused by astrologers: No, there is no way this chart shows those specific events; however, on the other hand, its salient features are consistent with that outcome (as an extreme outcome of many other possibilities).
What fits is that the chart shows significant conflict and hurdles, and one strong indication of "out of the ordinary" circumstances, probably out of the ordinary crisis, consistent with extreme isolation. The strong indication is Pluto square Ascendant, with the only other planet even moderately foreground is Saturn. Saturn and Pluto angular is consistent with (but not predictive of) being suddenly disgraced and sent to a decade of solitary confinement against horrible, abusive conditions, yes? Other conflict, paired with the foreground Saturn, is Moon partile opposite Mars. We might also notice the disruption of things from the mundane Saturn-Uranus square.
A close Jupiter-Neptune trine might (in theory) show disgrace of reputation, especially involving treason and treachery, though one usually wouldn't interpret it that way (so I should ignore it in the current musings).
Those who rely on houses may note the enormously strong and malicious 7th house, plus the Moon-Mars opposition reaching from the to 1H. If we treat the houses as valid, I think the most this means is that his life may be dominated by having enemies and perhaps legal conflicts: I find this woefully inadequate but not wrong.
If we take the closest, strongest midpoints we get quite a wrong impression: The strongest is probably MC = Su/Ju 0°02', a mark of dignity. As = Su/MC, similarly. We can find "bad" midpoint contacts, of course, and even uncertain ones (Su = Sa/Ur = Ne/Pl = Me/Ve) that just don't make the grade. The worse is Mo = Ma = Su/Sa, but the man was already a soldier with close luminary and angle midpoints showing glory and respect. - So, I'm not impressed.
I encourage others to dig deeper into this question using this chart.
I think one strongest factor for showing this assault, disgrace, and abuse - most unique to him and falling in a category that I think more likely shows "stuff that happens to you" - is in the mundane aspects of the nativity. In the prime vertical, not only does he have Moon opposite Mars (not at all as close as in the ecliptic) but also Mars opposite Neptune. This (even more so in the context of 1st-7th house) is not a bad indication of events, though it could also mean other things:
12°24' 1H - Moon
15°28' 1/7 - Mo/Ne midpoint
16°09' 7H - Mars
18°33' 1H - Neptune
I have only gone so far in examining this. My first impression leads me to the usual soft-sell compromise often espoused by astrologers: No, there is no way this chart shows those specific events; however, on the other hand, its salient features are consistent with that outcome (as an extreme outcome of many other possibilities).
What fits is that the chart shows significant conflict and hurdles, and one strong indication of "out of the ordinary" circumstances, probably out of the ordinary crisis, consistent with extreme isolation. The strong indication is Pluto square Ascendant, with the only other planet even moderately foreground is Saturn. Saturn and Pluto angular is consistent with (but not predictive of) being suddenly disgraced and sent to a decade of solitary confinement against horrible, abusive conditions, yes? Other conflict, paired with the foreground Saturn, is Moon partile opposite Mars. We might also notice the disruption of things from the mundane Saturn-Uranus square.
A close Jupiter-Neptune trine might (in theory) show disgrace of reputation, especially involving treason and treachery, though one usually wouldn't interpret it that way (so I should ignore it in the current musings).
Those who rely on houses may note the enormously strong and malicious 7th house, plus the Moon-Mars opposition reaching from the to 1H. If we treat the houses as valid, I think the most this means is that his life may be dominated by having enemies and perhaps legal conflicts: I find this woefully inadequate but not wrong.
If we take the closest, strongest midpoints we get quite a wrong impression: The strongest is probably MC = Su/Ju 0°02', a mark of dignity. As = Su/MC, similarly. We can find "bad" midpoint contacts, of course, and even uncertain ones (Su = Sa/Ur = Ne/Pl = Me/Ve) that just don't make the grade. The worse is Mo = Ma = Su/Sa, but the man was already a soldier with close luminary and angle midpoints showing glory and respect. - So, I'm not impressed.
I encourage others to dig deeper into this question using this chart.
I think one strongest factor for showing this assault, disgrace, and abuse - most unique to him and falling in a category that I think more likely shows "stuff that happens to you" - is in the mundane aspects of the nativity. In the prime vertical, not only does he have Moon opposite Mars (not at all as close as in the ecliptic) but also Mars opposite Neptune. This (even more so in the context of 1st-7th house) is not a bad indication of events, though it could also mean other things:
12°24' 1H - Moon
15°28' 1/7 - Mo/Ne midpoint
16°09' 7H - Mars
18°33' 1H - Neptune
Jim Eshelman
www.jeshelman.com
www.jeshelman.com
- Jim Eshelman
- Are You Sirius?
- Posts: 19068
- Joined: Sun May 07, 2017 12:40 pm
John Lennon
A good example of relocation:
For John Lennon's given half-hour birth time, his Ascendant for New York City - at his apartment, The Dakota, 40N46'36'' 73W58'34'', across the street from where Yoko dedicated Strawberry Fields and the Imagine Mosaic in Central Park - was 10°30' Sagittarius. His natal Mars was 8°45' Virgo, within 2° of the Zenith. While his life was good there in many respects, it's also where he was shot.
At the time he was shot (December 8, 1980, 10:50 PM EST), transiting Moon was 10°35' Sagittarius - conjunct that Ascendant almost to the minute. (BTW, I've stood in the courtyard of The Dakota at 9 or 10 at night. It's barely lit, and the surrounding streets are only minimally lit. I suppose it's for privacy? There are no guards or security barriers (which is why I could just walk off the street and up into the courtyard.) It's not hard to see how someone could hide there.
Of course, his solunars told the story as well. His SSR had Pluto setting 3° conjunct a Mars-Uranus conjunction (and Pluto opposite John's natal Jupiter-Saturn exactly rising). [And exactly opposite transiting Eris fwiw.] His November 14 SLR is mostly a surprise and change chart with Uranus opposite natal Uranus along the meridian being what's closest (with transiting Sun also closely on IC). His November 26 Demi-SLR, though, brought it all back home: With local natal Asc 10°30' Sagittarius and natal Mars 8°45' Virgo, the final Demi-SLR had transiting Mars 9°06' Sagittarius at Midheaven (0°45') and natal Mars on Descendant (0°59'). Transiting Mars square natal was Mars even closer mundanely (0°13') than it was ecliptically (2°39'). Transiting Jupiter-Saturn were also setting:
26°12' 6H - r Neptune
29°15' 9H - t Mars
29°15' 6H - r Mars
------------------------
0°10' 7H - t Jupiter
1°58' 7H - t Saturn
4°11' 7H - r Sun
His SNQ was loaded with meaningful angularities and aspects:
9°38' Cap - r Moon
9°56' Cap - SNQ MC
10°16' Can - r Pluto
1°38' Tau - r Uranus
2°07' Tau - SNQ Asc
2°30' Sco - p Sun
2°41' Sco - t Uranus
14°37' Ari - p Jupiter
14°38' Ari - SNQ EP
All the charts bring a bit of Jupiter - the mark of his celebrity affecting? - but always with malefics. His SQ isn't as dramatic as the SNQ, but it seems to tell a part of the story:
22°21' Vir - r Sun [SQ Sun 22°31' Vir]
22°40' Gem - SQ Asc
2°01' Vir - s Jupiter
2°07' Vir - r Neptune
3°08' Pis - SQ MC
Even the PSSR got a bite - maybe the most literal one: With MC 19° Pisces, transiting Mars was 19° Sagittarius.
For John Lennon's given half-hour birth time, his Ascendant for New York City - at his apartment, The Dakota, 40N46'36'' 73W58'34'', across the street from where Yoko dedicated Strawberry Fields and the Imagine Mosaic in Central Park - was 10°30' Sagittarius. His natal Mars was 8°45' Virgo, within 2° of the Zenith. While his life was good there in many respects, it's also where he was shot.
At the time he was shot (December 8, 1980, 10:50 PM EST), transiting Moon was 10°35' Sagittarius - conjunct that Ascendant almost to the minute. (BTW, I've stood in the courtyard of The Dakota at 9 or 10 at night. It's barely lit, and the surrounding streets are only minimally lit. I suppose it's for privacy? There are no guards or security barriers (which is why I could just walk off the street and up into the courtyard.) It's not hard to see how someone could hide there.
Of course, his solunars told the story as well. His SSR had Pluto setting 3° conjunct a Mars-Uranus conjunction (and Pluto opposite John's natal Jupiter-Saturn exactly rising). [And exactly opposite transiting Eris fwiw.] His November 14 SLR is mostly a surprise and change chart with Uranus opposite natal Uranus along the meridian being what's closest (with transiting Sun also closely on IC). His November 26 Demi-SLR, though, brought it all back home: With local natal Asc 10°30' Sagittarius and natal Mars 8°45' Virgo, the final Demi-SLR had transiting Mars 9°06' Sagittarius at Midheaven (0°45') and natal Mars on Descendant (0°59'). Transiting Mars square natal was Mars even closer mundanely (0°13') than it was ecliptically (2°39'). Transiting Jupiter-Saturn were also setting:
26°12' 6H - r Neptune
29°15' 9H - t Mars
29°15' 6H - r Mars
------------------------
0°10' 7H - t Jupiter
1°58' 7H - t Saturn
4°11' 7H - r Sun
His SNQ was loaded with meaningful angularities and aspects:
9°38' Cap - r Moon
9°56' Cap - SNQ MC
10°16' Can - r Pluto
1°38' Tau - r Uranus
2°07' Tau - SNQ Asc
2°30' Sco - p Sun
2°41' Sco - t Uranus
14°37' Ari - p Jupiter
14°38' Ari - SNQ EP
All the charts bring a bit of Jupiter - the mark of his celebrity affecting? - but always with malefics. His SQ isn't as dramatic as the SNQ, but it seems to tell a part of the story:
22°21' Vir - r Sun [SQ Sun 22°31' Vir]
22°40' Gem - SQ Asc
2°01' Vir - s Jupiter
2°07' Vir - r Neptune
3°08' Pis - SQ MC
Even the PSSR got a bite - maybe the most literal one: With MC 19° Pisces, transiting Mars was 19° Sagittarius.
Jim Eshelman
www.jeshelman.com
www.jeshelman.com