Knowing people just superficially

[TheScales_BothWays]

Originally posted by myself on Sun Feb 12, 2017 3:16 am
All times are in MYT/UTC+8

Looking at our fellow forum members' posts on Capricornians they know and comparing them to mine, I realise I probably know nobody that well; not just Capricorn Suns. I don't really know anybody well enough to, say, write a brief account about their general life like JSAD, Danica and other forum members did on Capricorns they know.

Is this just because of my age, or is this a trait of mine, being a double-rim (and hence only knowing people on the surface, etc.)?

[TheScales_BothWays]

Jim Eshelman on Sun Feb 12, 2017 3:27 am

Age is certainly a part of it - not just that you're young, but that you haven't educated yourself (or been educated) in how to observe and assess.

You have the kind of mind that is curious enough that you could read learn this easily enough. You might even enjoy a book or two on formal profiling. (I think Amazon has several of these.) Or just start watching.

Yes, as a double Rim, you have a greater tendency to look at the outside. Even then, this would open you to observing behavior, the outermost expression of someone. There are schools of psychology that think expressed behavior is all we really have to work with, and the rest is too conjectural - I don't agree with them, but I admit they exist and have their usefulness.

I larger barrier - self-awareness may overcome this easily enough, if you have the desire - is that you love your fantasies about people and how they are. I might venture that sometimes this is more fun for you than actually knowing them. You can't observe others accurately by watching your fantasies of them, though. (However, you can learn a great deal about yourself from doing that! <g>).

There are a lot of Hubs on this site, but a lot of Rims and Spokes, too. Here's a summary of luminaries of people who have been most active recently. You can see some interesting sub-patterns in this as well.

HUB
Jim (Aquarius Moon), Danica (Leo Moon), Debbie (Taurus Moon), Florence (Scorpio Moon), Jupiter Sets At Dawn (Leo Sun), StarAgeWiz (Taurus Sun), Steve (Scorpio Moon), Venus Daily (Leo Sun).

RIM
Arena (Cancer-Aries), The Scales Both Ways (Libra-Capricorn). Danica (Aries Sun), Florence (Libra Sun) Iaomai (Libra Sun), StarAgeWiz (Aries Moon).

SPOKE
Bogdan (Sagittarius-Sagittarius), Freya (Gemini-Virgo), James (Sagittarius-Pisces). Jim (Virgo Sun), Debbie (Gemini Sun), Iaomai (Pisces Moon), Jupiter Sets At Dawn (Pisces Moon), Steve (Virgo Sun), Venus Daily (Sagittarius Moon).

I'm surprised to see, with all the Hub presence, that we don't have any double Hubs routinely active. Veronica hasn't been around for a while. Maybe I can nudge Marion (Taurus-Leo) into showing up more.

[TheScales_BothWays]

TheScales_BothWays on Sun Feb 12, 2017 1:59 pm

Age is certainly a part of it - not just that you're young, but that you haven't educated yourself (or been educated) in how to observe and assess.

Hmm, yeah, very likely.

You have the kind of mind that is curious enough that you could read learn this easily enough. You might even enjoy a book or two on formal profiling. (I think Amazon has several of these.)

Just checked Amazon, and I've found some profiling books in Amazon that I'm finding to be interesting. I wish I (or my parents) had the money to buy them though. If any of us had, I'd already have bought the Sidereal Astrology books recommended in this forum too.
But after my recent "busybodyness" thread I felt really bad about my habit of observing and analysing people, I feel like that I'm violating their privacy. Your reply to my thread seemed like a big eye-opener.

Or just start watching.

There's a catch in this: as a Libra, naturally my eyes are a featured part of my body. People have always said that there's something about them (or that they're large), no one said that they're beautiful though. Coming to my point, I feel that people easily notice that I'm observing them, even when I'm not.
Two years ago, a group of Chinese girls in my class told me that they think I'm always staring at them, and that they feel vulnerable by it. But I don't; at least, not always? Yes, they're an interesting bunch of people that I'm interested in being friends with, but most of the time I probably just looked at them with the intention of why people randomly look at other people: for no reason.

Yes, as a double Rim, you have a greater tendency to look at the outside. Even then, this would open you to observing behaviour, the outermost expression of someone.

Yes, I believe I'm good at observing outer behaviour, but I'm afraid it makes me judgemental at times?

There are schools of psychology that think expressed behaviour is all we really have to work with, and the rest is too conjectural - I don't agree with them, but I admit they exist and have their usefulness.

Looks like a school of psychology I'd be interested in, if I get into psychology that is. But yeah, like you, I don't think expressed behaviour alone is all that needs to be worked on.

I larger barrier - self-awareness may overcome this easily enough, if you have the desire - is that you love your fantasies about people and how they are. I might venture that sometimes this is more fun for you than actually knowing them. You can't observe others accurately by watching your fantasies of them, though.

I suppose I do! Yeah, it is at times fun, adds more "flavour" into my view of their character. But I agree that it clouds my judgement.

(However, you can learn a great deal about yourself from doing that! <g>).

Yeah, and I guess I'm more judgemental than I thought, and also that I am really insecure.
____________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

There are a lot of Hubs on this site, but a lot of Rims and Spokes, too. Here's a summary of luminaries of people who have been most active recently. You can see some interesting sub-patterns in this as well.

Thank you for listing them!

HUB
Jim (Aquarius Moon), Danica (Leo Moon), Debbie (Taurus Moon), Florence (Scorpio Moon), Jupiter Sets At Dawn (Leo Sun), StarAgeWiz (Taurus Sun), Steve (Scorpio Moon), Venus Daily (Leo Sun).

I see that all/most of those in this forum that I consider to be wise in astrology (and wise in general life) are in this group. Having a Hub luminary would indeed help someone in learning astrology better, they're better in understanding the deeper aspects of the human psyche. Sometimes I wish I was born some hours later an be an Aquarius Moon instead, though not as much as I wish I was born without my angular Neptune.

RIM
Arena (Cancer-Aries), The Scales Both Ways (Libra-Capricorn). Danica (Aries Sun), Florence (Libra Sun) Iaomai (Libra Sun), StarAgeWiz (Aries Moon).

Here (besides Arena?) I see people who "go with the flow" (or something like that? no offence?) and readily accept guidances offered to them and others's insights of astrology provided there's a valid basis underneath it. If they have any opposing view(s) on astrology, they aren't that confrontive/defensive about it if someone else disagrees, mayyy be open to modifying them with the advice of the wise. And they're good in doing astrology just using what they know about it, like as if they were answering questions in a supposed high-school astrology exam. Not saying it's bad, it's in fact pretty straightforward and it's easy to understand what they're trying to say. No-nonsense (this may not apply to me since I have an angular Neptune).

SPOKE
Bogdan (Sagittarius-Sagittarius), Freya (Gemini-Virgo), James (Sagittarius-Pisces). Jim (Virgo Sun), Debbie (Gemini Sun), Iaomai (Pisces Moon), Jupiter Sets At Dawn (Pisces Moon), Steve (Virgo Sun), Venus Daily (Sagittarius Moon).

Here I see a lot of idea-people, giving their own valuable suggestions/opinions/methods on astrology. They discuss a lot about astrology too. More defensive about their opinions? (This may just be an apparent observation, no offence.)

I'm surprised to see, with all the Hub presence, that we don't have any double Hubs routinely active. Veronica hasn't been around for a while.

Yeah, I'm quite surprised too.

Maybe I can nudge Marion (Taurus-Leo) into showing up more.

Generally, I really love Tauruses and Leos. They're such sweet and radiant people to be with, especially if the Leos aren't too cocky about themselves. I know a gay person who's probably a Taurus-Leo too who's sweet and energetic/ebullient too.

[TheScales_BothWays]

Arena on Sun Feb 12, 2017 10:32 pm

Hehehe, it is of no surprise to me Scales that you do not see me as a person who goes with the flow, since that is probably the last thing I will do.
But I am also still able to see myself as both the sidereal expression of Cancer-Aries in some ways, but also the tropical Leo-Taurus. This means I never take things for granted, I always need to explore and be critical. This does not only apply to astrology, it counts for all areas of life.

But to your question above. I must tell you that I think it has solely to do with your age. But another factor is just the fact that in life we will meet a lot of different people and most of them might not be of interest to us, therefore we might not really want to connect with them on a deeper level. I see you have a tight Venus-Pluto square like I have (and Jim has it too). Pluto is about going beyond, digging deep - and Venus is about love and friendships. To me that is a sign of you wanting deeper connections with people. IF double rims are on the surface (it is certainly not the case for myself), then this Venus-Pluto tight aspect is the exact opposite, it wants to dig deep, very deep. It wants to know all the inner secrets of people that are of interest to them, it wants to understand and show empathy and it is indeed capable of doing so. I am not sure if it applies only to myself or also to others with this aspect, but I think that this aspect can make one a bit manipulative and possibly want to show their power in a relationship. I think that people with this aspect might be the ones that somehow instinctively always will find the weak spots to people and sometimes they push them in order to dig a little deeper under the surface. They will also want to share themselves and have loved ones share everything. But it might only be 1-10 people you choose to do that with, out of the hundreds you will meet.

So in your case I believe it is more a question of time and growing up. Since you are indeed a Libra (sidereally) that is to me someone who wants to please, to be friendly and is sometimes a bit superficial - but then you must look at other factors in the chart that show the whole makeup of a person.

[TheScales_BothWays]

Danica on Mon Feb 13, 2017 5:55 am

Scales, about Leos being cocky - I disagree with this; Mars types can be cocky (especially if Mercury is connected to Mars, or otherwise strong in the chart), Leos are simply intensely aware of importance of their own existence (thus, may seem too self-assured to people with less self-confidence).

[TheScales_BothWays]

TheScales_BothWays on Mon Feb 13, 2017 5:22 pm

But I am also still able to see myself as both the sidereal expression of Cancer-Aries in some ways, but also the tropical Leo-Taurus. This means I never take things for granted, I always need to explore and be critical. This does not only apply to astrology, it counts for all areas of life.

That could also be your [Sidereal] Aries Moon with your Moon-Mercury square through your angularity of Saturn. Just sayin'.

But to your question above. I must tell you that I think it has solely to do with your age.

I see where you're coming from.

But another factor is just the fact that in life we will meet a lot of different people and most of them might not be of interest to us, therefore we might not really want to connect with them on a deeper level.

Yeah.

I see you have a tight Venus-Pluto square like I have (and Jim has it too).

Wow, who else has this aspect too? JSAD has a partile conjunction, and Florence has a moderate square!

Pluto is about going beyond, digging deep - and Venus is about love and friendships. To me that is a sign of you wanting deeper connections with people.

Yes...

IF double rims are on the surface (it is certainly not the case for myself), then this Venus-Pluto tight aspect is the exact opposite, it wants to dig deep, very deep.

...yes...

It wants to know all the inner secrets of people that are of interest to them, it wants to understand and show empathy and it is indeed capable of doing so.

...and yes! Very true, all of what you said! Venus-Pluto in its essence.

I am not sure if it applies only to myself or also to others with this aspect, but I think that this aspect can make one a bit manipulative and possibly want to show their power in a relationship.

Interesting.
I've never been in an actual relationship, so I don't know how this plays for me. If Venus-Pluto is not the aspect responsible to this behaviour you find in yourself, then it may be your Aries Moon and rising Saturn instead.

I think that people with this aspect might be the ones that somehow instinctively always will find the weak spots to people and sometimes they push them in order to dig a little deeper under the surface.

Ooh. I am sometimes like this, but in such cases that I am so, it's usually when I'm Saturn to someone else's Mars.

They will also want to share themselves and have loved ones share everything. But it might only be 1-10 people you choose to do that with, out of the hundreds you will meet.

Yes, I also agree with this.

So in your case I believe it is more a question of time and growing up. Since you are indeed a Libra (sidereally) that is to me someone who wants to please, to be friendly and is sometimes a bit superficial - but then you must look at other factors in the chart that show the whole makeup of a person.

I see, and yes the whole chart is important.
And BTW, I'm tropically a Libra too; The Scales Both Ways.
Thank you for your reply, it was very informative and insightful.
__________________________________________________________________________

Scales, about Leos being cocky - I disagree with this; Mars types can be cocky (especially if Mercury is connected to Mars, or otherwise strong in the chart), Leos are simply intensely aware of importance of their own existence (thus, may seem too self-assured to people with less self-confidence).

I was having two Leo Suns in mind when I said that some Leos are cocky, otherwise I pretty much agree with you that it's Mars who can be cocky, not Leo.
The other Leo luminaries I know are in fact very sunny and exuberant, and exuding a royal aura that isn't really condescending.
I just analysed the charts of those three Leo Suns I had in mind: both of them have a partile Mars-Neptune aspect regardless of birth time. No wonder!