This is so many topics at once - but let's see what we can do with it (without getting too confused).
Yes, there isn't another main thread because MikeN had some ideas for a transit calendar that he never itemized and I was busy trying not to look at any predictive techniques at all (besides the current SSR/SLR options) until 1.0 was solidly, cleanly out - and then start envisioning the next, long-term extension. - But, hey, brainstorming can be fun.
Yes, depending on the technique, there are at least two kinds of things desired - static representations and reports giving changing details across a timeline.
Mike V wrote: Tue Jul 23, 2024 11:01 am
Configuration
I don't have complete thoughts on this yet, but I'm imagining that users will want to include or not include entire techniques (such as transits to novien points), they will want to include or not include some aspects (like octiles), and they will want to include or not include a set of points per technique (excluding secondary progressed non-luminary points, etc). I'm imagining something much less configurable than Solar Fire, so that we can potentially fit all of it onto a single page (except for a "select valid planets" screen per technique, sort of like how SF does it).
Probably it doesn't need to be said: Everything doesn't have to be done at once. Getting a solid functioning core set of tools can always be expanded to more peripheral things. For example, I wouldn't have even thought of enabling transits to Novien points and, in any case, I think those fall in "when everything else is working fine: sure, add that option too." (I'm not clear yet whether Novien positions will be saved or calculated on the fly each time the natal is calculated, and many other things about Novien-related infrastructure.)
But broadly: Yes, aspect choice with orbs on each (to include all aspects currently in the aspect pool for charts: co/op/sq, oc, tr/sx, inc. No need for a separate mundane column (irrelevant concept) unless you combine this table with other possible aspect tables like dynamic parans.
Yes, point selection (core points presumed, with option for additional points in whatever form this settle in for primary charts).
You indirectly point to a complexity that needs to be thought through: Thinking of two data sets (e.g., transits and natals) is simple enough, but these might be more complicated with several layers of things atop each other. This is most obvious in the commonplace transits - progressions - natal set. Which of these do you want? Do you want the same planets in each one (surely not - a separate user-modifiable planet list should be available for each layer - one might want only outer planet transits - one would nearly always want to exclude transiting Moon but might sometime want to have it, or have it ONLY - etc.). One planet list for progressions/directions (don't need a separate list for each kind) and one can have different custom options if you want these to differ. Enabling by a check box whether transits and/or prog/dir and/or natals are included in the output. Probably only a total of these three columns for planet selections.
There are 3 separate use cases for these non-chart techniques that I can think of:
Case 1: seeing what applies at a given moment.
This could eventually fall into the "burst of all predictive techniques" bucket.
The output would simply be a pile of factors and their orbs:
No no no. The "burst" idea was intended to be chart wheels of numerous techniques, not lists of aspects
except that the aspects between the wheels would be in the aspectarian. Things like, "calculate these 7 or 10 specific prediction charts for a specific natal and a specific event time/place."
This goes to my first point above: More than anything, we need static representations, e.g., transits and natal on a natal wheel etc. This generalizes to a particular multi-use concept MikeN had that a significant development threshold was being able to make a biwheel out of any two calculated charts. One could, of course, simply have progressions or transits come up this way, or one could simply have the ability to calculate a natal, calculate a progressed chart or event chart, and display them in a consolidated wheel. (Or a triwheel.) I see value in either approach (both approaches) of anticipating this display when asking for a chart (i.e., are you ever going to calculate a progressed chart without wanting the natals involved) and the approach of consolidating them. It seems, though, that a completely flexible "make a biwheel or a triwheel from any combination of charts already calculated, using the display options currently available for solunars" to be the front-end piece that makes the others easy.
I know that for research purposes, wheels capturing a specific technique for one moment in time are way more valuable than any number of lists, though for personal or client work a list of some kinds of things is the way to go - so, we need both, of course.
Ah, I see now. You were distinguishing lists from calendar and not thinking of wheels (which to me is the main
must do feature). I hadn't thought of a calendar that looked like a calendar; therefore, by "calendar" I was expecting a list LOL.
I may not have everyone else's sensibilities on the list/calendar options. With Solar Fire, I run nearly a dozen separate calculations items each month for myself and build an Excel spreadsheet. No other way to get all the exact things I want in one place, properly labelled, given visual weight, etc. I'm sure I'll never use a "try to fit it all into one list or picture? feature in TM other than to test that it's working right, so I might not be as good at brainstorming this.
Case 2: transit calendar.
This would just show, day by day for a month (for midnight, or maybe even noon), what's active and what their orbs are. I'm imagining this in an ASCII calendar-like table or possibly some CSV format for use in Excel/other spreadsheet.
Yes, .csv export makes sense and allows lots of flexibility (like calculating six of them, pasting them into Excel and resorting and formatting). I certainly have no objection to a calendar displayed format.
Case 3: Enter/exact/exit reports like Solar Fire.
This is the one I least want to do. I just think it's gonna be a massive PITA. The Swiss Ephemeris doesn't have any functions to find the exact crossing of a body to another point due to this being difficult; I have guesses about how Solar Fire can do this so quickly, but the problem is still what it is.
Wait... really? I thought MikeN explicitly said SE had this. (Am I remembering wrong?)
I'm less concerned about enter/leave timing, though that would be useful (and it's a variation of the same problem); but, after the ability to put any two charts into a displayed biwheel, the most basic functioning seems to be a chronological list of the times each selected planet aspects each selected natal factor. Does this really all have to be an iterative nightmare? (Isn't this basic to your calendar idea? I thought you wanted a calendar of exactly this information.)
SF must use iteration, come to think of it, because the time for "calculate a solar return" and "calculate transiting Sun conjunct natal Sun" can be slightly different.
The ability to do this - as a reusable function - is basic to things like kinetic returns (two bodies in motion crossing). I wasn't going to push for quotidian reports until version 3 or so - or the more complicated
transiting parans for which there is high demand - but they all require this basic function.
