Solunars by Aldebaran Sidereal Academy

Wow! Yes indeed, stunning symbolism. I had already seen the d. MC to Pluto.

The partile Moon-Jupiter is also GREAT. It seems to be a consistent success story to have Moon-Jup. I guess the strength is more in a conj/opp than it is for squares even though they are dynamic.

Arena wrote:

Wow! Yes indeed, stunning symbolism. I had already seen the d. MC to Pluto.

Jayne’s Arc methodology for Trump on day of election most certainly explains to me the manifested landslide victory for Trump. Arena, you recently asked me about transit aspects to Jayne’s arc directions. I noted t. Uranus 00,30 Tau is partile conjunct to Trump’s Converse Solar Arc PL 00,03 Tau and his r MC 00,19 Tau. This transiting combo brings in par-excellent symbolism for him experiencing an unexpected (Uranus) USA voting revolution (Uranus-Pluto), which thrust him back into the White House. This is actually a transiting Uranus Paran which would probably mean this was his most potent direction of em all!

As a side note: On Nov 16 I have an “outstanding incident” Mercury-Jupiter (fortunate communications) DSLR, backed-upped with a partile Sun-Uranus 180 falling partile on my r Jupiter-Node, all angular on my r ASC. I am hoping this brings me back into contact with Scott who has an audio from a seminar many years ago explaining more about Jayne’s work, and the possibility of Scott finding an astrological program that accurately calculates Jayne’s Declination Arcs for Solar Arc, Vtx Arc & ASC Arc directions. In the books I am studying Jayne has said the most important Arcs to research/study for rectification are the Declination Arcs. IMO, we really need to see these Declination Arcs to complete Jayne’s important work on all of his discovered arc directions. And I need to make contact with people who could possibly teach me more important details about Jayne's work/methodologies.

My Nov 16 “outstanding incident” DSLR (inside wheel); outside wheel Natal.

https://ibb.co/3NBmbQy

Let there be no doubts UK’s Nation has an accurate timed true Radical Chart proven by Jayne’s Arcs/Progression methodology. We can clearly see with par-excellent directed planetary symbolism London was headed for a “fated” malefic “Life Development” event with UK’s declaration of war with Germany on Sept 3 1939, hence, what would be labeled by world history as World War 11, so far UK’s most important “Life Development” in their history, other than when UK was born as a Nation on Dec 25 1066.

UK’s true Radical Chart: Dec 25 1066; 12:00 PM LAT; London, UK; 51N30; 000W13

London’s Solar & Converse Solar Arcs directions calculated to their “Declaration of War” on Germany, 9/3/1939 using on 0,90,180 aspects.

d ASC 04,01 Vir; r Saturn 05,05 Vir (A major “Life Development” angular hit)
d Pluto 12,39 Can; r ASC 13,28 Ari (Another “Life Development angular hit)

Converse Saturn 13,00 Ari; r ASC 13,28 Ari (Another “Life Development angular hit)
Converse ASC 21,23 Scorpio; Pluto 22,06 Aqu (Another Life Development angular hit)

*Note the 4 above angular directions hits, two for standard directions arcs; two for Converse arcs, the mathematical synchronicity for ASC—Saturn—Pluto symbolism, simply astounding!!

d Saturn 25,38 Cap; r Mars 26,43 Cap
Converse Mars 04,38 Vir; r Saturn 05,05 Vir

*Note again we see mathematical synchronicity this time with the symbolism of Mars—Saturn for a direction arc and a Converse arc. This Mars-Saturn symbolism was obviously for bombing “destruction” for London by Germany which was soon to follow UK’s Declaration of War on Germany.

d Mars 17,17 Gem; r Moon 17,22 Pi
Converse Moon 25,17 Lib; r Mars 26,43 Cap

*Again we see stunning par-excellent planetary symbolism and mathematical synchronicity with the same planets with a Solar Arc direction & Converse Solar Arc direction proving Jayne’s 43 years research with his team of astrologers stating:

There is evidence that converse directions may be more fated than direct ones.

Converse Neptune 18,21 Sag; r Moon 17,22 Pi.

Secondary Progression next for UK's Declaration of War.

I’ve never looked at that chart. My mother was born in London. Just from reading this post I see I have some strong synastry aspects that accurately describe some of my feelings. Very interesting, Thanks Steve. Curious Steve did you catch your synastry with that radical chart too. It was an out of the blue example, but with your Uranus Sun aspect maybe not?

V wrote:

...but with your Uranus Sun aspect maybe not?

I hear you V. A lot of times I awake in the early morning's hours with astrological things on my mind and I really don't know why they are on my mind. This is what happened with the post about UK's 1066 chart testing Jayne's methodologies. Ever since Trump got elected with a landslide I have been pondering which USA Radical would maybe show good symbolism for this event but I have not yet tested any USA charts with ALL of Jayne's arcs. I was born with a potential Sun (rising) Uranus (culminating) Paran which could explain why I awake with astrological things on my mind--not knowing why they were on my mind. It has been written when we awake there is a brief bridge of time between the conscious---subconscious mind where certain important communications exists between these two different consciousness, maybe where our better intuitions exists. I do so many different charts everyday in my retirement, I have learned through these many years to just flow with these early morning's astrological musings and see where this mystery leads me with my astrological interest. Anyway, I awoke with UK's 1066 chart on my mind and decided to test it with UK's Declaation of War on 9/3/1939 with Jayne's methodology, I was astounded! Other than that I have/had no particular interest in UK except when I wanted to travel to UK and go and experience Glastonbury because of a couple of books I read about Glastonbury being a very sacred site. When there I experienced one of the most profound inner experiences ever for my life.

Just calculated synastry with my chart and UK's radical and noted UK's Uranus partile my Vx, don't really know how to read this synastry.

That’s pretty cool actually Steve. Very interesting synastry.

In regards to your pondering about which USA Chart…..have you the radical information for the incorporation on the District of Columbia in 1790, July 16 I believe? I have had great results in mundane astrology looking at the dates different counties were incorporated in the USA, and while it’s not a county DC does have a birth chart that might be fruitful for exploration, especially for the people who live there and especially for those doing business.

For those interested in the full chart, who may not have it:

SteveS wrote: Fri Nov 08, 2024 8:18 am Arena wrote:

Wow! Yes indeed, stunning symbolism. I had already seen the d. MC to Pluto.

Jayne’s Arc methodology for Trump on day of election most certainly explains to me the manifested landslide victory for Trump. Arena, you recently asked me about transit aspects to Jayne’s arc directions. I noted t. Uranus 00,30 Tau is partile conjunct to Trump’s Converse Solar Arc PL 00,03 Tau and his r MC 00,19 Tau. This transiting combo brings in par-excellent symbolism for him experiencing an unexpected (Uranus) USA voting revolution (Uranus-Pluto), which thrust him back into the White House. This is actually a transiting Uranus Paran which would probably mean this was his most potent direction of em all!

As a side note: On Nov 16 I have an “outstanding incident” Mercury-Jupiter (fortunate communications) DSLR, backed-upped with a partile Sun-Uranus 180 falling partile on my r Jupiter-Node, all angular on my r ASC. I am hoping this brings me back into contact with Scott who has an audio from a seminar many years ago explaining more about Jayne’s work, and the possibility of Scott finding an astrological program that accurately calculates Jayne’s Declination Arcs for Solar Arc, Vtx Arc & ASC Arc directions. In the books I am studying Jayne has said the most important Arcs to research/study for rectification are the Declination Arcs. IMO, we really need to see these Declination Arcs to complete Jayne’s important work on all of his discovered arc directions. And I need to make contact with people who could possibly teach me more important details about Jayne's work/methodologies.

My Nov 16 “outstanding incident” DSLR (inside wheel); outside wheel Natal.

https://ibb.co/3NBmbQy

Very interesting Steve. My GOSH! I have to get these books.

About your side note, I don't have to ask if you noticed, since of course you know this. But I notice that the Mer-Jup angular aspect is aspected by your r. Saturn. And your r. Saturn is a bit brutal since it's quite close to Pluto. The communication might be fortunate, but it might also upset you in some way or your reaction to it may not be as you expected. I don't know, perhaps it's just a new research project for you to tackle.

I also notice another thing and it is a partile T-square formation of Sun-Nep/Uranus. And the return Sun-Uranus on your Nodes is involved into the mix by a wider aspect to this T-square. I don't know if Ebertin is right or wrong about this T-square, but he says it is sudden upsets or excitements nervousness and an inner emotional crisis.

I hope you may learn something new to share with us, even though it may upset you in one way or another.

Arena, with my life, whenever I see an "outstanding incident" return chart, I only focus on the angular symbolism--the rest of the aspects I consider as just background noise not affecting me significantly. For sure that t Nepune 180 my Sun has been affecting me off/on in significant Neptunian ways for many months with nagging Neptunian household problems, and 2 weeks ago our 1989 Dishwasher quit functioning causing us to buy a new one and the installers are late coming out to install---nagging Neptunian household problems again but it is background noise relative to my immediate environment. I am hoping that parile Sun 180 Uranus falling near my r ASC and on my r Jup/Node will manifest itself with leaning new things with Jayne's methodology---this is by far my main priority with my life at the present moments in my life---not the Dishwasher problem. I have not heard from Scott, my new Jayne contact (Node) from my last commucation with him several days ago. I will report when I see the main manifestation for this "outstanding incident" Mercury-Jupiter Nov 16 DSLR. You may be right in your read that I could be dissapointed when/if I do hear back from Scott during my DSLR.

OK, I am going to finish Jayne’s systems of methodology for the beginning of WW11 with UK’s Declaration of War on Germany. They are absolutely astounding!!! Since the Solar Arcs including Converse Solar Arcs has already clearly offered par-excellent planetary symbolism for the beginning of WW11, I will only give the rest of the Major Angular “Life Developments” for Secondary Progressions, Asc Arcs, and Vtx (Vertex) Arcs & Transits. Remember there is no way with SF I can calculate Jaynes 3 different systems of Declination Arcs, I suspect they would also offer par-excellent symbolism but Jayne said there would be less angular arc hits, since Declination move much slower than the other major arcs.

Secondary Progressions (SP) & Converse SP:

SP Uranus 27,52 Sag; r Sun 28,10 Sag; r MC 28,1O Sag.
SP Mars 26,53 Tau; SP ASC 25,57 Leo.
Converse SP Mars 26,34 Vir; r Vx 27,00 Vir.

ASC & Converse Arcs:

ASC Arc MC 1O,4O Tau; ASC Arc Sun 10,40 Tau; ASC Arc Vx 09,29 Aqu; r Neptune 10,26 Tau.
Converse ASC Arc Moon 27,26 Vir; r MC 28,10 Sag; r Sun 28,10 Sag; r Vx 27,00 Vir.

Vtx (Vertex) and Vtx Converse Arcs:

Vtx (Vertex) ASC Arc 15,32 Sag; r Uranus 16,41 Sag.
Vtx Converse Arc Neptune 12,31 Cap; r Asc 13,28 Ari

And last but not lease TRANSITS TO NATAL:

A Grand Trine of t Uranus 28,03 Ari t Neptune 28,40 Leo to r MC 28,10 Sag & r Sun 28,10 Sag. Also as a stand along transit in the heavens a partile 90 of Saturn-Pluto (heavy burdens), proving outer planet 0,90,180 aspects are super important for considerations with our planet earth.

I am super impressed with Jayne’s newly discovered Arcs methodology!!! As far as I can tell in my 40 years of studying astrology—very few astrologers became aware of Jayne’s Arc mythology, probably because astrological programs were not developed until the late 80s, early 90s, after the seminar age of astrological teachings in the 70s. I hope and wish Scott & I possibly working together can eventually find someone to develope a specialized program for Declination Arcs which Jayne indicated are more important than his other Arcs.

One of the main reason I chose the 1066 UK Chart for this Jayne research/study was the fact that WW11 is the worst event known history has encountered with mass deaths/destruction over the duration of WW11, and this war actually began in Europe with UK’s Declaration of War on Germany, two main Nations in Europe. We can clearly see par-excellent planetary symbolism of several hits to and from these chart angles beginning WW11 on 9/3/1939. Later, I want to test Jayne’s arc methods with a couple of USA charts to see if can see clear confirmation with Jayne’s arc methods for a true Radical Chart. In fact, I would like to test all of the different supposed USA charts with main “Life Development” events in USA history. I ask myself the question: Did Jayne present a USA chart he thought was a true Radical?

Jim wrote:

It's misleading to think of these as two separate contacts (and there is nothing surprising that they are synchronous). Because Sun's speed is reasonably consistent, converse solar arcs will always be mirrors of the direct solar arcs (within small variations of arc). This is simply one aspect: directed MC conjunct natal Pluto 38'. (How big the difference can get depends on exactly when in the year one is born.) That isn't true of Vertex arc, so it does make sense to check those separately. (However, the Moon-Jupiter example you gave is pretty wide.)

Just read this post by you Jim—somehow I missed it. Thank you so much for your astronomical knowledge—it helps me so much. I am so impressed with Jayne’s Arcs methodology, I cannot image he did not have his own reliable tested USA Radical Chart with his superb methodology. Combine this with the fact he wrote many years of mundane columns for Dell Astrology Magazine, I will give it my best effort to see if I can find Jayne’s possible Radical Chart for the USA.

SteveS wrote: Wed Nov 13, 2024 5:15 pm One of the main reason I chose the 1066 UK Chart for this Jayne research/study was the fact that WW11 is the worst event known history has encountered with mass deaths/destruction over the duration of WW11, and this war actually began in Europe with UK’s Declaration of War on Germany, two main Nations in Europe. We can clearly see par-excellent planetary symbolism of several hits to and from these chart angles beginning WW11 on 9/3/1939. Later, I want to test Jayne’s arc methods with a couple of USA charts to see if can see clear confirmation with Jayne’s arc methods for a true Radical Chart. In fact, I would like to test all of the different supposed USA charts with main “Life Development” events in USA history. I ask myself the question: Did Jayne present a USA chart he thought was a true Radical?

Very interesting Steve. I am curious about WWI and how the chart for the declaration of that war on July 28, 1914 shows? I was taught that the events of that WW directly led to the rise of the conditions that brought WWII to manifest.

V wrote:

I am curious about WWI and how the chart for the declaration of that war on July 28, 1914 shows? I was taught that the events of that WW directly led to the rise of the conditions that brought WWII to manifest.

Indeed V, it was a terrible trench warfare! I have got a-lot of household situations to handle today, but later I will defintely read up on WW1 and see if I can determine a clear location for "Declarations of Wars" with Nations.

Continuing my research into Charles Jayne prediction methods, the following link explains to me the most important arc method by Jayne. Unfortunately I cannot thoroughly research because as far as I know there is no astrological program that accurately calculates “Declination Arcs.

https://www.uraniatrust.org/astrology/d ... orecasting

Yes, we seem to have no way to do this. I thought I'd figured out a way to fool Solar Fire into doing it, but I was wrong.

Declination arc is calculated by determining the absolute value of the difference between the declination of the natal and the progressed Suns.

I'm probably oversimplifying, but this doesn't seem like it would be too hard calculate with a python script. If it would be helpful, I'd be happy to take a stab at it.

Hello Steve,

(Re: Declination Arcs)

So, you are taking the "travel" of the Sun's progressed declination, since birth, and using that to direct the chart's positions directly by longitude?

If so, on Nov 28, 2023; when my dear brother died, the declination arc of Neptune had moved around to oppose my natal Mars (0° 1' orb).

alinda wrote:

I'm probably oversimplifying, but this doesn't seem like it would be too hard calculate with a python script. If it would be helpful, I'd be happy to take a stab at it.

Stab away alinda. If it helps, this is the only example I have offered by a student (Bill Merriman) of Charles Jayne:

The following analysis of President Nixon's declination arc was presented at UAC 1995. He was born on January 9,1913 at 9:35 PM PST in Whittier, Ca. This places Saturn at 27 Taurus 29, his Midheaven at 16 Gemini 02, and his Pluto at 28 Gemini 39. During the 1960 election, his solar declination arc (SDA) MC was conjunct his Pluto. During Watergate, the addition of his SDA to his 9th-house Saturn brought the planet to his MC.

alinda, Bill was using tropical positions but you have the birth data here which can be computed with Sidereal positions if needed for your python script endeavors. Thanks for your feedback alinda.

ODdOn wrote:

So, you are taking the "travel" of the Sun's progressed declination, since birth, and using that to direct the chart's positions directly by longitude?

If I understand correctly---Yes ODdOn. Jayne said Declinations Arcs are more important than the other Arcs because their arc movement was much slower. By what I understand, Declination Arcs were Jayne’s go to arcs for rectifying charts. There are 3 different Declination Arcs Jayne used:
1: Solar Arc Declination
2: ASC Arc Declination
3: Vertex Arc Declination
I have been pushing hard to establish contact with other astrologers who were familiar with Jayne’s Arc methodology, but one big problem—they have died. I have sent Bill Merriman an e-mail---awaiting his reply.

I established contact with Bill Meridian and asked him which timed USA Chart Jayne was using for his mundane work. His response:

He used 3:
The Sibley Chart
The surrender of Cornwallis at Yorktown chart
The Articles of Confederation.
For most countries, there is more than 1 chart.

I asked Bill a couple of follow-up questions:
1: Would you happen to have any audio or video teachings seminars you have done on Jayne’s work for sale:
2: Do you know of any reliable software programs which calculates Jayne’s “Declination Arcs” for charts?
Any info you can provide I would really appreciate.

Jayne’s greatest accomplishments are largely unknown. He developed a working system of mundane astrology by the early 1940s. The techniques of ascendant, vertex, and declination arcs were developed to describe events that could not be explained by known predictive techniques. Bill Meridian

I heard back from Bill and he said there is no public software which calculates “Declinations Arcs”, they have to be done by hand along with a speculum. Bill gave me a couple of leads which may help my learning curve with Jayne’s methodology, but again the few astrologers who were adept with Jayne’s methodologies are either in their 70s/80s or have already passed away. You can include me at 77 as a Rookie learning Jayne’s material .

I do know this for myself studying astrology for 40 years, fwiw: You should be able to take Trump’s Natal or any other future CEO's Natal for the USA, and determine with Jayne’s forecasting methodologies along with SSRs/SMA, easily be able to get reliable reads on USA affairs since it appears there is no one USA Radical Chart to completely rely upon. As goes the Prez astrological cycles so goes the USA cycles . I hopefully expect to slowly be learning more refined details about Jayne's astrological methodologies.

To see if I understand this...

• We need to get the natal and progressed sun declinations.

• set the max solar declination (about ±23.44°?)

• calculate the declination arc as: D = |max - natal| + |progressed - max|

• this can then be added and deducted to the position of the natal planets

I admit I don't fully understand the astrology behind this, but the implementation doesn't seem too complicated, I don't see why it would need to be done by hand.

Yes, alinda, I believe that is correct. However, you only need to worry about the max declinations if the sun has to cross over one of the solstice points in its progressions. So, let's say the sun was at 0º Aries tropical at the time of birth. If you progressed it forward 30 days to represent 30 years, then it would be at approximately 30º Aries and the declination arc would be approximately 11º45'. But, let's say the sun was at 20º Gemini (tropical) instead. That would be approximately 22º50'N of declination at the starting time. To progress it forward 30 days, that would put it at approximately 20º Cancer, which would have a declination of roughly 22º20'N. So in that case, to get the total amount of declination arc it covered, you would need to factor in the max declination you mentioned of 23º27', which would provide a total declination arc of 1º34'.

So it's not too hard, but there is a bit of calculation involved if one of the solstice points gets crossed.

Also, Jayne had some other instructions regarding how to handle planets that are out of bounds. I need to re-read that part, but he seemed to be saying if a planet is beyond 23º27', then you take whatever its declination is (say the moon for example at 27º declination). You treat it as if it has already reached its maximum, even if it is still increasing in declination in the ephemeris. (i.e. how the moon is going up to 28º declination right now). You would then add or subtract your solar declination arc from whatever declination is present at birth. So in this example, if my progressed declination arc were 1º34', I would have to subtract that from the 27ºN of declination of the moon, bringing it down to 25º26'N, rather than taking it up to 28ºN first, and then continuing the arc from there.

I don't know how exactly Jayne handled this in situations where the planet could go out of bounds, but was still within bounds as of the time of the natal. So let say the moon was at 20º declination in the natal, but could go out of bounds to a declination of 28º. I'm not sure if he would just progress it only up to 23º27' and then begin to go the opposite direction, or if he would do something else.

I need to see more examples of his calculations.

[Edit: I'm also not sure how he dealt with retrograde planets.]

Sun's maximum declination is the obliquity of the ecliptic at birth. (Technically, at progressed date, but it doesn't move fast enough for that to be an issue.) Thus, for your birth, Alinda, it's 23°26'24".

Crossing maximum/minimum declination is the same as crossing Tropical 0°00' Cancer or Capricorn (or the Sidereal longitude square the vernal point).

THanks, I made a function based off the formula from, Astronomical Algorithms by Jean Meeus to get the mean mean obliquity of the ecliptic.
For my birth time I get:

That's close but not quite what you have Jim. I guess I have a start,

I suspect a few seconds of difference will make no difference except precisely at the solstices (if there).

I am very curious Alinda, Jim, Rings: Since you all know what you are doing with hand calculations, app how long would it take to do Trump’s 3 “Declination Arcs” for the rest of his term (to and from angles hits and lights)? 1: Solar Arcs; 2: ASC Arcs; 3 Vx Arcs. Even with you guys who know how to calculate by hand, this seems like a time consuming task?

Hey Guys/Dolls (you mathematical whiz kids ), I want to know this: Will Trump experience in his last term with any 6 of his Directional Arcs malefic action with his r 180 Saturn-Vx?

IMO, we need many different examples form Jayne’s hand for Declination Arcs to know for sure exactly how he was calculating em. So far, I can’t find a source for Jayne’s Declination Arc examples.

Steve, I don’t know if you have ever tried using an AI like “Bing”, but maybe AI could be used to do these calculations? AI is used quite frequently in the higher maths and sciences for tabulation of formulas and running simulations. I don’t see why it couldn’t be utilized to calculate these equations for you. Getting the initial data information and parameters written out might be challenging but once it is written then it should effectively run for any query.

That is a good V. Rings is in the process of studying Jayne's two books and like me she is somewhat confused with exactly how Jayne was calculating Declination Arcs. I will have to be taught how to do em if we can ever figure out exactly how Jayne was doing em. Thanks for the feedback and have a great Thanksgiving with your family.