Solunars by Aldebaran Sidereal Academy

Canadian clinical psychologist and a professor of psychology at the University of Toronto. Most known for his presence on YouTube, his stance against "political correctness" and against the Canadian government's Bill C-16 (which adds gender expression and gender identity as protected grounds to the Canadian Human Rights Act) and also for his self-help book, 12 Rules for Life.

His birth data was recently added to astro.com's databank last April:
12 June 1962, 2.49AM MST, Edmonton, Alberta, Canada.
Rodden rating: AA
https://www.astro.com/astro-databank/Peterson,_Jordan

Source notes:

astro.com wrote:Steven Stuckey emailed photo of birth announcement card, writing "Here is Jordan Peterson's data, sent to me by him via email. He sent a copy of his birth announcement (see attachment below) with permission to publish to the astrological community. He was born June 12, 1962 @ 2:49 AM MST in Edmonton, Alberta, Canada."

That Taurus Sun carries an unusually strong "harmlessness" factor, I guess... because otherwise this is one of the most severe, toxic charts I've seen in a while.

I immediately looked for the Mars-Saturn aspect. Found it.

Avshalom Binyamin wrote: Tue Jun 18, 2019 1:24 pm I immediately looked for the Mars-Saturn aspect. Found it.

In the activist sense, or something else?

Here are the main factors in the chart:

FOREGROUND
Angular Neptune (Dsc 2°08')
Angular Mars (Asc 3°20')
Angular Pluto (Dsc 5°18')
--------------------------------
Saturn square Neptune (0°06')
Mars square Saturn (0°20')
Mars opposite Neptune (0°26')
Moon conjunct Pluto (1°13' in mundo)
Mars opposite Pluto (1°58' in mundo)
Neptune conjunct Pluto (3°10' in mundo)
Moon opposite Mars (3°10' in mundo)

OTHER
Moon in Virgo
Moon trine Mercury (0°54')
Sun in Taurus
Mars in Aries
Mars sextile Jupiter (0°56')
Mercury square Jupiter (1°26')
Mercury trine Saturn (2°27')
Jupiter trine Neptune (0°55')

Because he is an impotent bully. But yes, all those other aspects are tough.

FlorencedeZ. wrote: Tue Jun 18, 2019 1:55 pm

Avshalom Binyamin wrote: Tue Jun 18, 2019 1:24 pm I immediately looked for the Mars-Saturn aspect. Found it.

Why? The aspect is not angular and it is not too bad

I think the partile aspect of Mars opposite Neptune and Pluto (the latter in Mundo) is the difficulty here.

Mars-Neptune is angular and Saturn squares right into it. The triple Mars-Saturn-Neptune, excruciatingly close, is the primary feature of the chart.

Moon and Pluto piled into the Mars-Neptune doesn't help.

Avshalom Binyamin wrote: Tue Jun 18, 2019 2:02 pm Because he is an impotent bully. But yes, all those other aspects are tough.

Ah, I see. That makes sense then. The chart could most easily be violent, abusive, and poisoning. (Not necessarily, but most easily.)

I don't have a clue who this guy is except for what Scales listed above, and from that he sounded like a civil rights hero. The Taurus Sun was the only salvation of harmlessness.

He's a darling of young alt-right men right now. At first glance, he appears to be smart and helpful, and talks a lot about Jung in interesting ways. But he espouses a lot of toxic ideas that really boil down to resentment that white men are not as culturally dominant as they have been historically.

Well, three cheers for astrology which picked that up right away LOL!

But I'm confused: If that's who he is, why is he an advocate of including gender expression and gender identity in the category of special protections under their civil rights act? That's not alt-right at all.

He's very against it.

Avshalom Binyamin wrote: Tue Jun 18, 2019 3:13 pm He's very against it.

Ah. That makes much more sense. I totally got that backwards. Now his chart makes sense!

He's a meaner, more effective, more strategic Donald Trump. Afflicted angular Neptune demagogue.

Jim Eshelman wrote: Tue Jun 18, 2019 2:16 pm I don't have a clue who this guy is except for what Scales listed above, and from that he sounded like a civil rights hero.

Oh no, he's no civil rights activist Av gets the gist of him pretty well.

Jim Eshelman wrote: Tue Jun 18, 2019 3:07 pm But I'm confused: If that's who he is, why is he an advocate of including gender expression and gender identity in the category of special protections under their civil rights act? That's not alt-right at all.

I'm so sorry, my bad. Instead of "against...Bill C-16" I wrote "for...Bill C-16". I wrote this before I got to sleep late last night. I've corrected it now.

I'm glad you don't know him, Jim. He's mostly popular among and commonly attracts Western, North American, young, troubled, middle-class white men who have lost a sense of purpose and direction in life and somehow he (with his self-help) appears as a father figure to them that made them "stand up straight with with your shoulders back" (that's the first "rule" from his "12 Rules for Life" book). He places a lot of the burden as to why (white) men aren't living their best life these days on feminism, social justice and etc. You might not want to watch any YouTube video that features him.

His stance against the Canadian Bill C-16 was (primarily?) that this could mean that using the wrong pronoun for a transgender person could get you convicted under that act, and therefore it is "against free speech".

I was stunned to see that his self-help book was being sold in a major bookstore here in Malaysia, and I was like, "Gosh, how influential is he here?"

I think the cool victory for astrology here, Scales, is that his chart seemed severely at odds with who I (wrongly) thought you were saying he was. At a glance (really, just a few seconds of looking) he seemed exactly like you tell me he is.

Jim Eshelman wrote: Tue Jun 18, 2019 7:03 pm I think the cool victory for astrology here, Scales, is that his chart seemed severely at odds with who I (wrongly) thought you were saying he was. At a glance (really, just a few seconds of looking) he seemed exactly like you tell me he is.

Indeed! When I first saw his chart I felt it was a perfect fit for everything he is.

Avshalom Binyamin wrote: Tue Jun 18, 2019 2:26 pm He's a darling of young alt-right men right now. At first glance, he appears to be smart and helpful, and talks a lot about Jung in interesting ways. But he espouses a lot of toxic ideas that really boil down to resentment that white men are not as culturally dominant as they have been historically.

Yikes
He's not very popluar here when he gave talks at the University of Amsterdam, many academics pleaded to boycot him. And he was on national TV on a talk show. His straw reasoning, presenting the point of view of someone else in a distorted way because it is easy to beat, to make yourself more convincing quickly, overshadowed the actual position of the opponent. People got really fed up with these tactics.

TheScales_BothWays wrote: Tue Jun 18, 2019 10:09 pm Indeed! When I first saw his chart I felt it was a perfect fit for everything he is.

Yeah.. Wow.. So fitting. I'll confess it makes me happy to see him so easily laid bare.

On another note, though, the mundoscope really makes a huge difference on this one.

Lance wrote: Wed Jun 19, 2019 12:45 pm On another note, though, the mundoscope really makes a huge difference on this one.

Yes, it does... especially with Pluto. But, since you're teaching these days, I should point out that that rest is pretty easy to see from a glance at the Campanus horoscope. The 6th and 12th houses are 90° wide along the ecliptic!!! Crudely, you can take one-third of those houses (in this case, that's 30°) and know that it's about 10° of the prime vertical (one-third of the house). Once you set a mental boundary of around 29° Virgo-Pisces, it's at once clear that the Mars-Neptune is quite close.

To check this estimate, note that Eastpoint is 1° Aries - roughly at that boundary - and its mundoscope position is 8° above Ascendant. The estimate works pretty well.

You can do the same with Venus: The 4th house is 9° wide on the ecliptic, Venus is 2° off the angle in longitude, a third of the house is 3°, so you can estimate she's at the edge of foreground - and you;d be right, she;s about 10° off. (I didn't pay any attention to foreground Venus because it's borderline and there are so many other strong factors of an opposite nature).

Pluto always needs checking, though, especially when setting. If someone doesn't have access to the mundoscope calculations but has altitude, they can see Pluto is is 3°50' below Dsc, which is going to be roughly correct. Similarly with Moon 6° in altitude below horizon. In PV longitude, Pluto is 5+° below, Moon 6+°.

But altitude isn't perfect. In this case, it would make Sun and Mercury seem much closer to the horizon than they are.

With what you guys are telling me about Dr. Peterson, I also found fixed stars unusually interesting. He was born with Sun exactly opposite Ras Alhague, the brightest (alpha) star in Ophiuchus, making him (so to speak) the "alpha" Snake Charmer. This struck me as very descriptive of his demogogery. He is also born at the exact setting of Antares, the brightest star in Scorpio. Ophidian symbolism is rampant in his chart from these stars - he is both the "alpha" Snake and the head "snake charmer. (Trump's Moon is exactly conjunct Ras Alhague, and the similarities are substantial. There might be something to this "alpha Snake Charmer" theme.)

He's also born at the exact setting of the recently photographed black hole. (I'm born exactly at M87's rising, so I have to be careful how I characterize this .)

IMO, the key in all walks of life is to not to judge others too quickly.

I looked into Jordan Peterson last year after hearing some angry people bash him and I wondered what was causing that storm. IMO it was simply a storm in a teacup and all the fuss was imo really blow way out of proportion. Some of what I saw when actually listening to the man himself instead of listening to others speak about him, was to me taken out of context and distorted by others. I think he has a very rational, logical approach and has a tendency to be easily misunderstood.

By this I am not saying I agree with everything he says. Just saying that people may be a bit too quick judging and creating a storm out of nothing.

Arena, this has been happening for a very long time. It's sadly still happening.
There's a very gentle frankness about Dr. Peterson that is very Venusian in nature. My ex was also a Taurus/Virgo combination, and he could get fired up, but he was a total pussy willow when push came to shove. I guess Peterson's fixed stars and Martial placement make him a force to be reckoned with.

There actually is a fair bit of difference in the location of where he was born and where he grew up.

Edmonton, Albert where he was born is 53N33, 113W28. Asc is 29°28' Aries, MC 28°02' Sagittarius. Angularities are:

Neptune on Dsc +2°08'
Mars on Asc +3°20'
Pluto on Dsc +5°18'
Moon on Dsc +6°30'
Moon on IC -9°57'

Fairview, Alberta where he grew up is 56N04, 118W23. Asc is 25°42' Aries, MC 23°25' Sagittarius. Angularities are stronger and their priority rearranged. There is also one truly extraordinary difference: He grew up with a rare 0°17' Neptune-Pluto conjunction less than half a degree from an angle!

Pluto on Dsc +0°04'
Neptune on Dsc +0°21'
Mars on Asc +1°35'
Moon on Dsc +3°27'

Fairview, Alberta where he grew up is 56N04, 118W23. Asc is 25°42' Aries, MC 23°25' Sagittarius. Angularities are stronger and their priority rearranged. There is also one truly extraordinary difference: He grew up with a rare 0°17' Neptune-Pluto conjunction less than half a degree from an angle!

Jim, can you expand on this? Why is that extraordinary?

The reason is given in the exact part you quoted: He grew up with a rare 0°17' Neptune-Pluto conjunction less than half a degree from an angle.

Sorry, I more meant what is the significance of this. As in, what difference, if any, would this make to his chart? What does a 0°17' Neptune-Pluto conjunction do and does it matter that it's less than a degree from an angle?

You want me to interpret the Neptune - Pluto aspect for you? Please understand, I'm working remotely with limited computer resources this week, mist if the time voice dictation on my phone, so I'm trying to say as words as I possibly can.

You could go to the Aspects section of the forum and look up Neptune-Pluto aspects. There is even a separate recent thread on that aspect showing the process of disentangling and interpreting it, and that might be of even more interest to you then simply reading the results and interpretation in the aspects section. But I suggest you start with reading the primary paragraph on that aspect.

I'm at a keyboard now, so I can type a little more freely and copy a couple of things.

The relevance of the close angularity is that, often, when someone relocates at a young age and has very close angularities, they incorporate those traits into their character more than other relocations later in life - the energy becomes part of the experiences that shape their character. Were it not for this, that Neptune-Pluto aspect wouldn't have been a big deal for him,. At an older age, it would have been something to affect him while at that location and then to pass away more quickly.

The rareness is important because astrology basically describes distinctions between us based on the mathematical odds of a particular chart feature existing. Neptune-Pluto conjunctions haven't existed for about a century ecliptically, so the only way they can be formed is mundanely. Having such an aspect form so closely AND be so closely angular is a statistical big deal, something mathematically distinguishing him from others around him. Though it didn't occur in his natus for birthplace, the fact that it occurred in a locus during formative years is noteworthy.

So what does a natal Neptune-Pluto conjunction mean? There is a longish thread recently where I detailed this from observations of historic figures. That thread shows some things better than the final conclusions, so you might want to read it: https://solunars.com/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=3081

Thanks Jim, appreciate your response! This in-depth astrology is quite new to me, so sometimes when I see a paragraph of strange terms and numbers I just have no idea how to suss any of it out.

A short video, JP.

https://www.facebook.com/14591758880571 ... 201867200/

"Out of all the people that I'm friends with, you're probably the most misrepresented friend that I have."

Enjoy the full conversation with Joe Rogan on iTunes: https://apple.co/2K2SQsW

“Jordan Peterson’s 5 Most Controversial Ideas, Explained”

https://www.google.com/amp/s/bigthink.c ... n.amp.html

That first video where he challenges the existence of white privilege... It’s overtly calm in tone, but he occasionally betrays a seething hatred of what he’s criticizing. (“I have a very vulgar picture in my mind.” “...they’ll eventually figure it out if they don’t kill everybody first.”)

He tried to make the categories of “race, ethnicity, sexual proclivity, and gender” sound arbitrary among an infinite number of possible categories and therefore meaningless in his entirely post-modern attempt at deconstruction. But these categories weren’t selected arbitrarily by “postmodernists” to advance “their Marxist agenda.” (Yes, he actually says that. Seriously.) They are categories of oppression by the historically dominant culture. They define the current culture war. He literally acts as if he is unable to understand something so obvious. It insults my intelligence.

I instantly find him to be pseudo-intellectual, intellectually dishonest, and offensive.

And I totally see his hardened reality that he powerfully projects and his fear of things becoming other than how they’ve been: Neptune-Pluto.

Thanks for sharing that, Arena. I really like his talks with Joe Rogan. Rogan has had him on his show a few times, and I think Rogan has a level-headed approach to him. Because as anyone who knows Rogan is aware of, Rogan is very much left-leaning... But Rogan is sensible (most of the time), and has a keen awareness of when someone is being unfairly lambasted by the media.

And thanks for the laugh, Lance. I think JP himself would find it equally hilarious that he's being accused of post-modern deconstructionism

From a basic Wikipedia article on Postmodernism:

...Postmodern thinkers frequently call attention to the contingent or socially-conditioned nature of knowledge claims and value systems, situating them as products of particular political, historical, or cultural discourses and hierarchies.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Postmodernism

Jordan Peterson:

...."I can't quite figure out why the postmodernists have made the canonical distinctions they've made: race, ethnicity, sexual proclivity, sexual ..gender identity, let's say. Those are four dimensions along which people vary. But there's a very large number of dimensions along which people vary, right? In fact, given that there's an infinite number of ways of interpreting the world, you could immediately point out that there's an infinite number of dimensions along which people vary. And so then the postmodern question is 'why would you privilege some of those dimensions over the others?' And I would say, 'Well, because it sustains your bloody Marxist interpretation, that's why, but you're not going to say that because it marginlizes... right? You've marginalized that so you can ignore it. That's one of the fun things about postmodernism - you can... I have a very vulgar image in my mind but [laughs]... I won't share it with you, but you can infer it."

https://bigthink.com/21st-century-spiri ... -explained

That's actually a pretty good example of postmodern deconstruction.

You mocked me for giving my honest take, so now, I've made my case. At this point, however, I'm gonna walk away from this.

And let's make sure that, from this point on, this thread (if it continues) remains about the astrology of the matter, and not on somebody trying to "sell" others on this character. It could get way out of hand as it did before.

I moved all the other debate about him to a separate thread in Club Aldebaran where it won't be mistaken for astrological discussion and won't become a permanent feature of the forum (since that content will self-destruct a short while after people stop engaging on the thread.)