Solunars by Aldebaran Sidereal Academy

Opening this Topic on the USA Boyd Chart, which I believe is an accurate timed USA Chart timing many important events in the history of USA. I will be looking for major important symbolism (past & future) for this chart primarily using the Personal Points (Sun-Moon-Angles) with Solar Arcs as well for its Sidereal Solar Returns (SSRs) & Sidereal Lunar Returns (SLRs), primarily using Sidereal Astrology Principles. I will be learning as I post in this Topic for past events as well for possible future events.

Boyd's Natal USA Chart:
https://imgur.com/ZsVmd9A

World World 1 ends Nov 11 1918 with Peace Treaty signed by the USA in Dec 1918. 1918 Boyd Sidereal Solar Return (SSR) featured an 'Outstanding Incident' 1918 SSR with Venus rising at 18,04 Taurus on Boyd's SSR ASC at 18,14 Taurus-- Partile Conjunct Boyd's Natal Jupiter at 18,00 Taurus.

Boyd's 1918 SSR Inside Wheel; Boyd's Natal Chart Outside Wheel:
https://imgur.com/fKMscLH

Outstanding Par-Excellent SSR Symbolism!

Yes, I've always known that this chart for America's first declaration of war responds very well - especially through solar and lunar returns - for matters of war and peace and a few other things that seem related to war and peace.

Jim wrote:

Yes, I've always known that this chart for America's first declaration of war responds very well - especially through solar and lunar returns - for matters of war and peace and a few other things that seem related to war and peace.

You know better than me about the Boyd Chart with Sidereal Astrology Return Charts. I am just now becoming fully conscious about the Boyd Chart which has proved to me it has timed the worst economic crises in the history of the USA with the Great Depression using Solar Arcs with Boyd's Natal Pluto. And just this past week you got me to look at only the criteria for your 'outstanding incidents' Saturn SSRs with the entire history of Boyd's SSRs. When I combine Solar Arcs with Boyd's Natal Pluto and your criteria for 'outstanding incidents' Saturn SSRs for the Boyd Chart, it tells me there is very high % we are now in the mists of another Great Depression Cycle for the USA.

IMO, I think the Boyd Chart deserves much more economic crises cycle attention other than just war related events, and this is partly what I want to explore with the Boyd Chart. Posting my thoughts about the Boyd Chart with only the simple 'outstanding incidents' angular astrological cycles pertaining to the Boyd SSRs helps me learn more about real astrological timing truths for USA economic crises cycles.

Through reading only a handful (few dozen) past American Astrology Mag articles, I only know a little about the faith other Astrologers put into the Boyd Chart. Of course Helen Boyd and Firebrace put a lot of faith into the Boyd Chart, they both wrote in Helen's Book a lot about the Boyd Chart. I think I remember Jim Lewis put a tremendous amount of astrological faith into the Boyd Chart---don't know for sure if Jim Lewis was a Sidereal Astrologer.

Next, I want to explore/discuss Boyd's 'outstanding incident' Saturn-Pluto 2020 SSR, since this is offering Saturn-Pluto symbolism which is also featured in the 2020 Capsolar. IMO, both Boyd's 2020 SSR and 2020/2021 Capsolars are strongly foretelling us very bad economic conditions are on the USA horizon when we allow your thoughts about Saturn offering par-excellent symbolism for any types of contracting economic conditions.

You have access to all the Spica issues in which Boyd and Firebrace originally rectified it and then displayed their results with lots and lots of charts. These include most of volume 2 and several others.

Jim wrote:

You have access to all the Spica issues in which Boyd and Firebrace originally rectified it and then displayed their results with lots and lots of charts. These include most of volume 2 and several others.

Yes, their work is becoming more brilliant to my astrological mind pertaining to the field of Mundane Astrology; second to Bradley's work rectifying the equal 30 degree divisions of the Sidereal Zodiac for Sidereal Cardinal Ingresses with the DC Capsolar as the Master Mundane Chart for the year. Combining the Cardinal Ingresses now with DC Boyd's SSR/SLRs could may become a more useful mundane tool using Sidereal Astrology Principles. I will endeavor to use historic example years/months to demonstrate. Lets see where this goes with your feedback/experience with Sidereal Astrology with viewing the important events in USA History.

One of the coolest astrological teachings I learned from Jim's about Return Charts is to note when our Natal Planets appears on the angles of a Return Chart. In many cases this tells us how we will REACT to the Return Chart's symbolism. For example: my current SSR brought my Saturn-Pluto to the angles, and I have been mentally reacting to all the Saturn-Pluto stuff happening in the world due to this pandemic, particularly to the harsh economic contractions in economies offering possible Depression numbers.

Another great example of this Sidereal Astrology teaching from Jim about reactionary Natal Planets on Return Angle charts is seen in the 'outstanding incident' 1918 DC SSR for the Boyd Chart linked in the beginning of this topic. We see WW1 ending with a Peace (Venus) Treaty participated strongly by the DC figureheads. This is of course symbolized by SSR Venus (Peace) partile conjunct 1918 SSR ASC. How did the DC figureheads/country REACT to its Venus themed SSR? The Country and DC reacted in a Jupiter manner with Boyd's Natal Jupiter partile conjunct 1918 SSR ASC. These type 'outstanding incident' SSRs are rare—but amazing synchronicity with a transiting planet syncing-up with a Natal Planet both landing on a SSR Angle.

We have another rare 'outstanding incident' SSR occurring with Boyd's next 2020 SSR, link below. Unfortunately its not a benefic incident SSR. For the first time in USA's history we have t. Saturn partile conjunct a SSR Angle (DSC) with Boyd's Natal Pluto partile conjunct the same DSC angle. The history of Boyd's SSRs have proven when Saturn is 0,90,180 a primary angle—economic contractions occur. Also very important: Boyd's 2020 SSR features an angular SSR Pluto partile 90 Boyd's Natal Moon symbolizing an 'outstanding incident' pertaining to Moon-Pluto symbolism. So, lets see how the officials in DC and/or the Country will REACT to Boyd's Natal Pluto and its very malefic SSR.?

Another of my favorite Sidereal Astrology tools come from Donald Bradley's book Solar & Lunar Returns where he says:

Lunar returns, while more powerful in immediate effect, are subservient to the preceding solar return. Therefore, we must look to the lunar returns for proof that lunar returns usually “time” the major occurrences foreshadowed in the solar return.

Below is a link to Boyd's Sept 1 2020 Anlunar, a lunar return for Boyd's 2020 SSR Moon. I don't have much research experience with Anlunars, but I know some Siderealists put faith in Anlunar Charting. It may be only 'outstanding incident' Anlunars are important, I don't know. But, if ever there was a lunar return chart---this Anlunar for Boyd's SSR Moon may "time" the Saturn-Pluto themed SSR and Moon-Pluto themed SSR. Time will tell.

Boyd's Sept 1 2020 Anlunar
https://imgur.com/Xf2Dcqf

The mundo chart for this Anlunar features a tight angular Venus/Saturn =Uranus. There may be an important DC figurehead who may suddenly be separated from their position. This Anlunar is very ominous when seeing the very malefic symbolism pertaining to DC's 2020 Capsolar. I make no definitive prediction except the Country in in for some malefic times beginning in Sept 2020.

Since I have a conditioned background with studying long term economic cycles, and have always had a burning passion to know & understand the true astrological timing causes for the worst economic cycles in USA History, I want to explain what I deem as one of the main astrological economic timing truths about the Boyd Chart relocated from Philadelphia to Washington DC . Below is Boyd's DC Natal Chart with nothing but wheel and angles. Note the time of Boyd's Chart produces a Squared 4 90 degree quadrant Circle with the Primary Angles. Of somewhat interest Bradley's/Fagan's Synetic Vernal Point (SVP) falls on Boyd's Horizon/DSC.

This produces for DC the angles:
MC 6,10 Gem
ASC 6,26 Virgo
IC 6,10 Sag
DSC 6,26 PI

Here is an economic historical astrological fact with Solar Arcs and the Boyd Chart. So far, involving the entire USA History, every time Solar Arc Pluto is Directed to partile orb of Boyd's Primary Natal Angles, the worst economic Decade Times occur in its History.

Here are the dates for these Directed Pluto's to Boyd's DC Natal Angles:
1/1/1840: Solar Arc Pluto 6,06 Pi (Boyd's Natal DSC)
1/1/1930: Solar Arc Pluto 5,50 Gem (Boyd's Natal MC)
1/1/2020: Solar Arc Pluto 7,04 Virgo (Boyd's Natal ASC)

This produces a SET of 3 90 year cycles timing the worst unemployment figures in the entire history of USA for these 90 year Decades. Unemployment figures were not kept in the Decade of 1840, but economic history records it was a nasty Economic Decade. Again, wise words from Cyril Fagan:

Pluto is the Planet of crises, it acts with dramatic decisiveness, leaving the status quo irrevocably altered, if not shattered.

But, FWIW, I see mostly a Bi-Partisan Government very proactive in eventually getting the needed $ and Legislation to its People to help them in this present Pluto 'Crises.' I also see a very benefic proactive Federal Reserve serving as a solid backstop for its Nation and People. We will all get through this Crises understanding we are witnessing Mother Nature with Angular Sidereal Astrology Principles at work, some TIMES are Bad, some TIMES are Good, "Timing is Everything." Also at work is Sidereal Mundane Astrology with t. Pluto partile conjunct Capsolar Sun, the Capsolar being the Master Mundane Chart of the Year. And, it just so happens, t. Pluto is partile 90 Boyd's Natal Moon. In mundane astrology, Moon symbolizes the People.

Boyd's relocated DC Natal Chart:
https://imgur.com/LURnEnS

I think it is important for the Sidereal Mundane Astrologer to realize what is actually happening with DC Boyd's Chart pertaining to Solar Arcs with its Angles to its Planets; and, Solar Arc Natal Planets to its Natal Angles. When we relocated Boyd's Philadelphia Natal to Washington DC, it moved Natal Mars to partile conjunct its ASC, probably the main symbolic reason the Boyd Chart reflects so much acute symbolism pertaining to Wars. But Boyd's Chart is manifesting other important angular events other than just Wars.

For example: On Nov 22 1963 when President Kennedy was assassinated we see a very important Solar Arc angular hit with the following planetary combo:
Boyd's DC Solar Arc ASC: 12,39 PI
Boyd's DC Solar Arc Mars: 12,00 PI
Boyd's Natal Saturn: 11,20 Virgo

This is seen with the eyes in the following link with Boyd's DC Chart Solar Arc to the day of the assassination, Nov 22 1963 (Inner Wheel), and Boyd's DC Natal Chart (Outside Wheel). Allow your eyes to look on the Horizon of this linked bi-wheel, and you see this Mars-Saturn combo timing the assassination.
https://imgur.com/jZWfeIZ

Mars-Saturn combos are known for symbolizing any type of destruction jolt, and with my Generation, almost everyone remembers where they were on the day President Kennedy was tragically assassinated. This loss of a President was a huge emotionally destructed event as a collected Whole to ever hit the Nation.

As I posted earlier, when DC's Boyd Natal Pluto is Solar Arc to Boyd's DC Natal Angles, it sets up Paran phases to Boyd's Natal Mars, and this is timing stunning/shocking economic down trends lasting many years. Boyd's DC Solar Arcs involving its Natal Angles are timing very important events in the history of America beside America's involvement in major wars.

A good time for me to post the astrological criteria I am using for selecting the historical important events with the Boyd Chart.

The three main astrological techniques I am most interested in testing with the Boyd Chart are the following 3. It will be these 3 astrological techniques which will select/pick most of the important historical events seen with the Boyd Chart.

1:'Outstanding Incident' technique for Sidereal Return Charts using the criteria from Jim's book 'Interpreting Solar Returns' stating:

It is when angularity and partility (1 degree or less) coincide that outstanding incidents are most likely to come about.

2: Partile 0,90,180 aspects with the 4 Moons & Suns. Natal Sun & Progressed Suns; Solar Return Moons & Solar Return Progressed Moons.

3: Solar Arcs involving 0,90,180 partile aspects with Noel Tyl's main Solar Arc criteria:

There is nothing more important than the Angles of a Natal Horoscope. It is safe to say that nothing vitally important in life development occurs without Solar Arc angular contact---or contact with the Sun or Moon. Angles are crucial.

Jim writes from his book 'Interpreting Solar Returns:'

This then, isolates the Moon as the most crucial agent in a Solar Return, after the angles. Lunar aspects to natal and solar planets can never be treated lightly, even when rather wide in orb. So remarkable is this single factor that, if lunar aspects are nearly exact while the foreground planets are not exceptionally close to the angles, the solar Moon can be considered the primary theme-setter of the chart for the year ahead, bar none.

In 245 years of Sidereal Solar Return (SSR) history for the Boyd Chart, there has only been 4 SSRs which featured a partile (1 degree orb or less) Moon-Saturn 0,90,180 aspects, and only one partile conjunction. Looking at the SSR years for these 4 SSRs with Moon-Saturn is most revealing!

In Mundane Astrology with Nations, the Moon has much to do with the People of the Nation. And partile 0,90,180 SSR Moons combined with SSR Saturns is classic par-excellent symbolism for a Depressed (Saturn) People. In my life time (72 years), on a collected whole for the People of the USA, I have never seen the People more depressed than when John F. Kennedy the USA President was assassinated on Nov 22 1963. Boyd's 1963 Solar Year was the only Boyd SSR in 245 years to produce a partile Moon-Saturn conjunction—SSR Moon 28,05 Cap; SSR Saturn 27,51 Cap.

Boyd's 1963 DC SSR:
https://imgur.com/JO3YdeI

Other Boyd SSRs producing partile 0,90,180 Moon-Saturns with the main events for these SSRs years:

1845: Moon 24,42 Can; Saturn 25,13 Cap (July 19-Great New York Fire)
1901: Moon 20,19 Pi; Saturn 19,30 Sag (President McKinley was shot and killed)
2004: Moon 23,07 Pi; Saturn 22,07 Gem ( 3 Major Hurricanes make landfall in the USA, the most in any one Solar Year; a failed assassination attempt on Bush).

Up-next: 2022: Moon 29,09 Lib; Saturn 29,15 Cap. SSR Neptune partile cnj SSR Nadir; Boyd's Natal Neptune partile cnj SSR Zenith

That's really good!

(But what is this Great New York Fire and why don't I have it in my collection?)

I ran all the SSRs from 1800 on (so I didn't have to worry about where the capital was) and also found 1954. It was a 0°15' Moon-Saturn conjunction with Venus and Pluto 2° on either side of Asc (As = Ve/Pl).

BTW, 1901 was particularly interesting for McKinley's murder with a Moon-Sun-Saturn T-square anchored by Moon on IC. The conjunction was foreground in 1963 also, and mundanely square Neptune (partile) with shocking Uranus on MC. But the most interesting angles were probably 2004 with Uranus 0°47' from MC, Pluto 0°08' from Descendant, and the Moon-Saturn square aligned within minutes with natal Sun.

At least, by these standards, 2022's chart is mild.

Another list you might want to play with: There were three years that SSR Moon was within 1° of 0/90/180 Boyd natal Saturn. These were 1808,1848, 1943.

While I'm at it, here are a couple of other lists you may want:

SSR Moon partile hard aspect to Boyd natal Mars (six times since 1800):
1806, 1909, 1930, 1987, 1989, 2006

SSR Moon partile hard aspect to SSR Mars (three times since 1800):
1866, 1958, 2017

Jim Eshelman wrote: Wed May 06, 2020 7:35 am That's really good!

(But what is this Great New York Fire and why don't I have it in my collection?)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Fir ... ork_(1776) No time of when it started, but it burnt 10 - 25% of the houses in occupied NYC.
Burned through the night of Sept 20 - 21st, 1776.

Jim asked:

(But what is this Great New York Fire and why don't I have it in my collection?)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_New ... re_of_1845

Jim wrote:

The conjunction was foreground in 1963 also, and mundanely square Neptune (partile) with shocking Uranus on MC.

Exactly! And yes, I did note that 'mundane square' with Neptune (partile)---probably the main aspect which impacted the American People with Depression (Saturn) in such a sickening (Neptune) manner. I was only analyzing partile eclipto 0,90,180 Moon-Saturn aspects, but indeed that mundane Neptune 90 is very important with Boyd's partile Moon-Saturn cnj in its 1963 SSR.

Jim wrote:

At least, by these standards, 2022's chart is mild.

Yes, I understand. I have a main economic expectation (speculation) for Boyd's 2022 SSR and that is a possible serious dose for all kinds of inflation, but I will have to wait and see what the economic numbers are going into the 2022 SSR before making a final decision. What I am really eyeballing with Boyd's 2022 SSR is the fact Boyd's Sun 22,40 Gem is partile conjunct McWhirter's NYSE 1792 ASC. And t. Neptune in 2022 will be partile conjuncting NYSE MC (0,31 Pi) in 2022. I am a huge believer when outer planets partile cnj angles of an important Mundane Charts---it times fireworks with the outer planet's keywords symbolism. So, when I look at Boyd's 2022 SSR and McWhirter's NYSE Mundane Chart, I see a triple whammy of angular Neptune. Makes me speculate---WTF is this symbolizing?

SteveS wrote: Wed May 06, 2020 8:37 am So, when I look at Boyd's 2022 SSR and McWhirter's NYSE Mundane Chart, I see a triple whammy of angular Neptune. Makes me speculate---WTF is this symbolizing?

It means you're looking at the same event using two different charts. Just because it shows in more than one chart doesn't make it stronger. It's like if you can see your driveway from a window in your house and you go to a different window and can see the driveway from there too. It's just a different vantage point. Doesn't make the driveway longer.

I don't think planets aspecting planets or points in other unrelated charts mean anything. Unless you've studied these two charts to see if they interact? I don't remember seeing you post that previously, but I might have missed it.

Excellent point. I wrote in passing on this 40 years ago as a point of mundane astrology: When Chart B is an event from Chart A, it probably has planet locations in common.

The Act of Union creating The United Kingdom as the successor to Great Britain occurred January 1, 1801. This was an event within the Great Britain chart for December 25, 1066. Is one chart better than the other? Well, you're likely to confuse them when you start tracing transits , because the older has Sun and MC 28°11' Sagittarius and the younger has Moon 27°28' Gemini; while the younger has Sun 18°13' Sagittarius and the older has Moon 17°22' Pisces. That's quite an interchange! One can bet (regardless of which chart is true) that 17-18° and 27-28° Spoke will be important for events in England's history. (Take a look at Queen Elizabeth's chart in this regard.)

The older has Neptune 10°27' Taurus; the younger, as a transit to that, has Pluto 10v49' Aquarius. The younger has Mars 26°44' Capricorn, the younger has Neptune 26°46' Libra. They pile up.

Switching to the U.S., the Boyd and Declaration of Independence charts have Sun within about a degree of each other (22°40' and 21°31' Gemini, respectively). They also match, to the degree, Jupiter to Uranus (42'), Saturn to Venus (06'), and Neptune to Mars (56'). Transits to 22° Gemini, 17-18° Taurus, 11° Spoke, and 29° Hub are going to be important regardless of which chart is stronger or more alive.

Besides, with that 21°31' Gemini July 4 Sun, the number of U.S. major events with planets exactly at 21° Spoke is quite impressive.

So they're linked charts, not just charts that happen to have planets and/or points in common. That's better than unrelated charts having a coincedence.

I will read Boyd's 2022 SSR with a bias economic slant. Boyd's Natal Neptune has only one cosmic structure---Jup/MC partile 90 Neptune, which I give a high(er) % for inflation with a false sense of a good economy. Boyd's Natal Neptune is partile cnj 2022 SSR Zenith also offering a high(er) % for inflation. Boyd's 2022 SSR Neptune is partile cnj SSR Nadir, also offering a high(er) % for inflation. A double whammy of angular Neptune for Boyd's 2022 SSR. Backed-up with a partile Moon-Saturn 90, an inhibiting aspect for the People. Inflation is the greatest destroyer of purchasing power of the $, greatly inhibiting (Saturn) the People (Moon). It would not surprise me to see the highest inflation numbers ever in the history of the USA with Boyd's 2022 solar year.

Bill Meridian, a financial astrologer says this about Mundane Neptune citing Jayne's Mundane astrological work:

Jayne cited Neptune as being the single most prominent factor in the dissolution of countries. This usually was accompanied by monetary inflation. Jayne interpreted Neptune as being the planet of large scale finance.

I will closely be following possible “large scale finance” by the Central Banks to drastically increase the money supply—a main fundamental ingredient for inflation. The Central Banks will probably be forced to do this trying to pull the Country out of the severe economic contractions caused by hardcore angular 'outstanding incident' Saturn-Pluto in Boyd's 2020 SSR which will probably continue in 2021. I expect this drastic increase in money supply to start happening with the Jupiter-Neptune conjunction in April 2022.

As a coincidence, in the same time frame I see t. Neptune coming to a partile conjunction of McWhirter's NYSE MC. I have proven to myself McWhirter's NYSE is a true timed radical chart. If I see the fundamentals in place from the Central Bankers for inflating the money supply, I expect this Neptune transit to NYSE MC to inflate the value of most stocks on the NYSE, producing a rip-- snorting Bull Market.

I also read a high(er) % for an assassination of a high official in Government with the main Moon-Saturn-Neptune in Boyd's 2022 SSR.

Mundo 1929 Boyd's Sidereal Solar Return (SSR):
https://imgur.com/o0p0Ge2

IMO, the planetary symbolism for the collapse of the Stock Market in the Autumn of 1929 is best reflected in Boyd's 1929 Mundo SSR.

We see an immediate foreground tight mundo conjunction of Moon-Mars-Neptune. Ebertin for this 3 planet combo:

Undermining circumstances affecting life detrimentally.

There is a background mundo T-Square of Mercury/Saturn = Uranus. Ebertin for this 3 planet combo:

Great inner tension.

For the destructive riots in US over the George Floyd killing.

Current Boyd 'Outstanding Incident' May 5 SLR:
https://imgur.com/jfRmdc1

We see 'outstanding incident' Moon partile 90 Pluto & partile 120 Mars, par-excellent symbolism for these destructive riots. Mundo SLR Moon and SLR Pluto partile cnj ASC & IC.

Current Boyd 'outstanding incident' May 19 Demi -SLR:
https://imgur.com/psVnWQn

An angular culminating Demi Moon partile 90 Pluto, with Demi Saturn 3,31 cnj DSC.

With this long lasting t. Pluto partile 90 Boyd's Natal Moon, we have been witnessing 'stunning/shocking' Pluto Symbolism with a collapsing economy, pandemic, and now US Riots. Whats next?

Direct Midpoints involving angles in a Natal Chart are critical! Robert Hand writes:

I find that direct midpoints are as important as major aspects in influencing a chart. One neglects them at one's peril; if you use no other midpoint, use these. Direct Midpoints involving the Sun, Moon, Midheaven, or Ascendant are to be taken more seriously than others. The effects of individual midpoints will be seen most clearly when they are set off by dynamic factors such as transits, solar arc directions, or progressions.

In the Boyd Chart there is a tight orb foreground Direct Midpoint of Mars/Saturn =Ascendant, a very “serious” direct midpoint. Ebertin says about the “Principle” for Mars/Saturn:

Harmful or destructive energy.

And now, after 245 years for the entire history of the USA, we see for the first time in USA history-- Solar Arc Pluto partile conjunct Boyd's Ascendant.
We can now see “most clearly” the mundane effects of the pandemic and the riot results of George Floyd's killing happening in the US now with Solar Arc Pluto partile conjunct Boyd's Natal ASC. This forms a most potent “destructive” combination for Boyd's Natal Chart: Mars/Saturn=Ascendant=Solar Arc Pluto.
Ebertin says about Mars/Saturn=Pluto:

Brutality, the rage or fury of destruction. (murder, death of many people).

Obviously manifestations for the effects of the pandemic and now effects of the George Floyd killing. Again, Cyril Fagan (RIP), out father of Sidereal Astrology, says about Pluto:

Pluto is the Planet of crises, it acts with dramatic decisiveness, leaving the status quo irrevocably altered, if not shattered.

Unfortunately, the USA with the Boyd Chart is now manifesting “crises” TIMES with Solar Arc Pluto sitting on Boyd's "destructive" Mars/Saturn=Ascendant Direct Midpoint. The main Natal signature for Boyd's Natal Chart is the Direct Midpoint of Mars/Saturn=Ascendant! No doubt in my mind: The Boyd Chart and its Sidereal Astrology extension of astrological principles is timing the 'destructive' times in USA History. Everyone, take extra precautionary measures with your decisions/actions.

Thank you for sharing these insights.

I for one plan on staying out of the city, and have told the kids and thier friends as well to stay put.
With the soon to be full moon there is just to much risk for me to make emotional unrational choices. I really wanted to join the clean up efforts yesterday but I decided that going to my dads house and cleaning up there and visiting him was what I personally should be doing.
Our local news and social media have been filled with "the looters are going to the suburbs to murder and rape and steal"
I tell ya....I feel so blessed to have found this home so that my kids and I are safe and away from the ugliness that seems to be sweeping my county and state and country. Intervention by a higher power is also a delineation for that Pluto aspect and that is at least how I personally feel as I have listened to that higher inner voice and acted on its impulses.

Steve: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_s ... _formation

Perhaps you can study some other countries as well with solar arcs. That list is just a start, of course. But it should make it easier to find actual date for the time and place.

It should also be interesting when looking at former aspects and sign changes.

A lot of timed national charts were discussed in Spica, and we have those issues available.

The longest term, though, would be England - timed birth chart in 1066.

I understand V, stay safe . Thanks JSAD and Jim for your pointers to other World Charts, but I will keep my main focus on the Boyd Chart.

Next, I want to discuss the 'outstanding incident' Feb 13 2020 SLR for the Boyd Chart, since this SLR timed some damn good astrological symbolism for the onslaught of the economic lockdowns and collapse in the Stock Market, and the Sept 5 2020 very malefic 'outstanding incident' Demi-SLR with the Boyd Chart, both eclipto and mundo for these two SLRs.

As I have often stated on this forum, one of my most valuable Sidereal Astrology guidelines was taught to be from Jim's book 'Interpreting Solar Returns' pertaining to 'outstanding incidents' return charts. Again, I will quote Jim's words from his book:

Partile aspects (1 degree or less) reign supreme. It is when angularity and aspect partility coincide that outstanding incidents are most likely to come about.

This is actually a most simple but very important teaching about return charts in the field of Sidereal Astrology, imo. All one has to do is set their computer programs up isolating when a return planet is partile aspected to another return planet or to a natal planet, and one or both planets are angular. I have absolutely become spoiled with 'outstanding incident' return charts, always on the look out for when these 'outstanding incident' return charts infrequently occurs in my life. 'Outstanding Incidents' return charts are my number one go to chart when I want to plan/time important incidents for my life, or if malefic, I want to be fully conscious of my immediate environment(s) for damage control.

In the last few months, I have looked at 'outstanding incident' lunar return charts with the Boyd Chart to realize they certainly time certain 'outstanding incidents' in the history of the USA. Relative to my life's interests pertaining to markets, I am beginning to believe the Boyd Chart with the Sidereal Astrology technique extension for 'outstanding incident' lunar returns, is a chart not to be ignored but to always isolate when they do occur for possible 'incidents' to manifest. I have many examples of 'outstanding incident' lunar return with the Boyd Chart. Here is one: On Monday Oct 19 1987 (Black Monday), an 'outstanding incident' occurred in the USA, and it was timed with Boyd's 'outstanding incident' Demi- Sidereal Lunar Return (DSLR).

The stock market crash of 1987 was a rapid and severe downturn in U.S. stock prices that occurred over several days in late October 1987. ... On October 19, 1987–known as Black Monday–the DJIA fell by 508 points, or by 22.6%. Up to this point in history, this was the largest percentage drop in one day.

Jim has proven with only one of his exhausted research projects “Reports” (free on this forum), the planet Neptune is strongly associated with panics in markets, when angular with mundane charts. Below is a link showing Boyd's Oct 7 DSLR.

Please Note: DSLR Neptune is partile conjunct DSLR Zenith, but this stand alone DSLR does not classify as an 'outstanding incident' return chart. But, when we bi-wheel this DSLR to Boyd's Natal Chart (link below), it definitely classifies as an 'outstanding incident' return chart with DSLR Neptune (10,47 Sag) partile 90 Boyd's natal Saturn (11,20 Virgo).

Boyd's stand alone Oct 7 1987 DSLR:
https://imgur.com/KpwAAdI

Boyd's Oct 7 1987 DSLR (inner wheel); Boyd's Natal (outer wheel):
https://imgur.com/oXjGs9l

Here is a well defined 'outstanding incident' SLR (Feb 13, 2020) for the Boyd Chart which perfectly timed the declared Pandemic with its restricted social distancing-- penetrating the consciousness of the Nation's People along with a severe sudden economic contraction reflected with a collapsing Stock Market. Both the Ecliptic and Mundo charts are truly “Outstanding!” using Jim's definition for an 'outstanding incident' return chart which states:

It is when angularity and aspect partility (1 degree or less) coincide that outstanding incidents are most likely to come about.

I know of no better symbolic descriptive Sidereal Astrology Chart which timed perfectly the 'outstanding incidents' (Pandemic/Collapsing Economy) which manifested in the Nation between Feb 13 2020 and March 11 2020 (the next SLR).

First the Eclipto Feb 13 2020 Boyd's SLR:
https://imgur.com/AA9ADr7

Note angular SLR Pluto (for 'stunning/shocking' Pluto symbolism) partile 90 SLR/Boyd's Natal Moon (symbolizing the people of the Nation). SLR/Boyd's Natal Moon is partile conjunct West Point in RA. Angular SLR Saturn is partile semi-square Mercury (for business contraction (Saturn) and depressing (Saturn) news (Mercury).

Second, the Mundo Feb 13 2020 Boyd's SLR:
https://imgur.com/KhzMCiG

This mundo SLR is truly an excellent example where Jim has always taught one must always check mundo charts for true astronomical placements of planets to a charts angles. Note the partile 180 of SLR/Boyd's Natal Mundo Moon partile 180 SLR Mundo Uranus, both within 2 ½ degrees of the Horizon (angular). This mundo angular Moon-180 Uranus struck the Nation like a Lighting Bolt-- Sudden and Unexpected.

SteveS wrote: Fri Jun 05, 2020 5:15 am I know of no better symbolic descriptive Sidereal Astrology Chart which timed perfectly the 'outstanding incidents' (Pandemic/Collapsing Economy) which manifested in the Nation between Feb 13 2020 and March 11 2020 (the next SLR).

The Capsolar-Caplunar-CapQ showed it perfectly, flawlessly. One doesn't need any national chart at all. (That's what we're used to seeing on almost every major event: The ingresses fully, vividly show it, national charts are irrelevant.)

Event: 2020 Stock Market Crash 2/20/2020, 4:30 PM EST (measured by close of the market)

Capsolar: Uranus most angular, in mundane square to Sun-Saturn-Pluto on MC; Saturn-Pluto conjunction 0°15' is the closest foreground aspect.

Caplunar: Tight Moon-Saturn-Pluto conjunction closely rising, Moon-Saturn conjunction is 0°03'.

Day: Transiting Saturn crossed Capsolar MC February 1 to March 11; it was 0°04' from the angle at market close. Transiting Mars triggered crisis by squaring CapQ Moon February 18-21 (0°34' for market close). A CapQ angle crossed Mars the day of the event.

Jim, where I wrote:

I know of no better symbolic descriptive Sidereal Astrology Chart

I meant to write Sidereal Astrology Return Chart (Moon/Sun). You know how much faith I put into Sidereal Mundane Charts, particularly the Capsolars.

That did give me a chance to make the sideways point that I'm less interested in national charts than I ever was before, not because they don't have value but because they aren't the strongest, clearest way to the goal and, ultimately, how many charts can we look at? (I don't even do my own Kinetic Lunars, thought I know I probably should.)

And then there is the problem that there are probably multiple charts for each nation, each likely showing something slightly different - the first European settlement on the continent, the first declaration of war, the eruptive birth moment of the Declaration of Independence, the Constitution, the first presidency, the current presidency, the treaty ending WW II, the moment 9/11 hit, the first Supreme Court convening, each declaration that redefined our base economy... these are probably all valid charts that show a different layer of the nation. Meanwhile, the ingresses disregard boundaries and fluidic definitions of nations, expressing themselves for all spots on Earth and concentrating their attention on ego-centers like capitals.

I was just talking to another forum member this morning about the way the way each president's natal chart gets lifted to serve as a national chart of sorts. The president's character is certainly an expression of what the collective national mind selects to represent its current period. Lots of presidents have seemed to "lose their horoscopes" to the nation - the chart has become a more overarching descriptor of the country for a time. (Think of Trump's natal Saturn being transiting by Pluto right now as an expression of how "it's all falling apart" not just for him but much more broadly than him. Is this a "dismantling of old things"?) His chart is a battle between kindness and compassion on one hand vs. insidious infantile cruelty on the other, with violence, heartlessness, deception, and chaos dominating, but with a potential for awakening and progress hidden behind it all. That's not a bad summary of the struggle in the national soul during this time.

Jim wrote:

(Think of Trump's natal Saturn being transiting by Pluto right now as an expression of how "it's all falling apart" not just for him but much more broadly than him. Is this a "dismantling of old things"?)

Excellent question. The only thing I know about Trump's charts/cycles this Autumn-- they are very malefic---can't be good for him.

And I understand your thinking about National Charts. Its just that I have recently been looking at a-lot of SLRs charts for Boyd's Chart, and the more I look at--the more intrigued I become because both Fagan and Bradley highly favored SLRs as being potent charts for certain immediate effects. And when I combine these possible 'immediate effects' with your guidelines for 'outstanding incident' return charts---the Boyd chart becomes even more intriguing for me with only 'outstanding incidents' Sidereal Return Charts. I already know without any doubts in my mind--the Boyd Chart is symbolizing important events in the Nation with angular Solar Arcs.

I see two very malefic Boyd 'outstanding incident' lunar return charts early Sept--which I will post about in next post.

SteveS wrote: Fri Jun 05, 2020 9:56 am The only thing I know about Trump's charts/cycles this Autumn-- they are very malefic---can't be good for him.

BTW, under the logic that Trump's natal chart is an "alter ego" nativity for the United States, this also would mean that things are very malefic for the U.S. in the fall.

Jim Eshelman wrote: Fri Jun 05, 2020 9:06 am Lots of presidents have seemed to "lose their horoscopes" to the nation - the chart has become a more overarching descriptor of the country for a time. (Think of Trump's natal Saturn being transiting by Pluto right now as an expression of how "it's all falling apart" not just for him but much more broadly than him. Is this a "dismantling of old things"?) His chart is a battle between kindness and compassion on one hand vs. insidious infantile cruelty on the other, with violence, heartlessness, deception, and chaos dominating, but with a potential for awakening and progress hidden behind it all. That's not a bad summary of the struggle in the national soul during this time.

That is not a bad summary at all.
In fact it sounds like a most excellent one,
and if,
as citizens of this national soul we individualy and intentionally feed the side of compassion and kindness,
The incideous side hopefully will starve and fade away.

Jim wrote:

BTW, under the logic that Trump's natal chart is an "alter ego" nativity for the United States, this also would mean that things are very malefic for the U.S. in the fall.

Indeed. For sure we are seeing things show-up very malefically for the Nation as a whole with the Pandemic/Economy and the tragic George Floyd killing, which Trump has to feel malefically for his re-election chances.

An ideal flashed into my mind. If one's Natal MC has to do mainly with Career goals/objectives---then the 2020 Prez election priority would be to first strongly take into account aspects involving Trump's Natal MC when analyzing % for a second term election. I will do a complete analysis for Trump's MCs involving transits, progressions & solar arcs later for election day, and post under 2020 Prez election thread.

... in light of the current sequence of events, and the sharp polarization in the nation that's now becoming so openly and painfully visible as seemingly non-resolvable antagonism, I'm reflecting on the fact that this whole huge Experiment in human Togetherness based on principles of Liberty and aiming toward Human fulfilling our highest potentials, has begun, i.e. was born (in our astrological framework, the phenomenon emerged as Event) with the Sun in Gemini: the very life of this Native is depicted by an image of two children playing! - there needs to be the duality, and the polarization; the Play itself is the Unifying thing!
consider the Gemini key words: REASON. PLAY. ÉGALITÉ.

NB: there's a theory of Human that defines the human being (as species, as phenomenon, ultimately) by its activity of Play: Homo Ludens
I've read Huizinga's book long time ago (many times, granted); have ordered it now to read it again, from vantage point of current experience and perspective; also, Parker J. Palmer has written a book titled Healing the Heart of Democracy, and subtitled The courage to create a politics worthy of the human spirit; I haven't got very far into it, but from what I've read thus far, a key theme he points to re how to resolve the conflict yet not annul the diversity, and duality/polarization: we all need to primarily learn how to Listen.
This act/operation of listening essentially means: being present for each other, in each moment of interaction-communication-contact, simply present each as-we-are for the Otherness of other as it is.
(Palmer is an Aquarius Sun with Gemini Moon!)

For general discussion of such Gemini themes as duality overall, here is an article (reproduced years ago on this site) by young Donald Bradley from 1949 about the U.S. horoscope, roughly when he was discovering the Sidereal zodiac for the first time.
viewtopic.php?f=28&t=625&p=3981

Steve, I just noticed something about the Boyd chart that I don't think I've noticed before: Not only are the three malefics the strongest factors, they are all very closely aspected - once we look at all kinds of mundane aspects.

What follows, of course, presumes the 11:00 AM LMT birth time is correct. I don't think Firebrace ever intended it to be thought exactly. Helen Boyd had originally thought the charts fit for approximately 10 AM, Firebrace studied it across events and came back saying he thought it should be more like an hour later - so he'd work with 11 AM.

Nonetheless, for what follows I will calculate as if the time is exact.

First, the conventional way of looking at angularity, primarily via the mundoscope:
Saturn 2°34' below Asc
Mars 2°12' above Asc [this already gives As = Ma/Sa 0°11']
Neptune 9°13' above Asc

These are the closest ways of showing angularity, though we also have Mars on EP-a 1°41'.

However, check Mars' azimuth: It is 89°59', i.e., 0°01' from due east. Another way to say this is that it is 0°01' in mundo from the Antivertex, 0°01' off the prime vertical. I don't place much significance on that, except that it alerts me to check for PVP aspects: mundane aspects formed by a planet on the prime vertical with a planet on the horizon. While you could say that Mars and Saturn are both foreground and centered (midpoint) on Asc, or that they are less than 6° from conjunction in longitude (and less than 5° in PV longitude), their closest aspect is a square (!) - a square between Mars' position on the PV circle and Saturn's position on the horizon circle.

Not only that, Neptune's azimuth is 91°15', meaning that it is 1°15' from Antivertex mundanely of 1°16' from conjunct Mars in azimuth!

All the calculations go like this:

Mars: azimuth 89°59' [0°01' before Av], PV amplitude 0°00' [exactly on PV]
Neptune: azimuth 91°15' [1°15' after Av], PV amplitude 1°14'
Saturn: altitude -2°34' [before Ascendant]

PVP conjunctions are taken in azimuth. PVP squares with a horizon planet are taken by subtracting the PV planet's PV amplitude from the horizon planet's altitude. The final orbs are:

1°16' Mars-Neptune conjunction
2°34' Mars-Saturn square
3°49' Saturn-Neptune square

These are the three aspects that the three foreground planets make with each other in the Boyd chart.

Interesting Jim, I find it somewhat difficult to relate these malefic PVP aspects to the life of Boyd Chart. What is your take?

SteveS wrote: Thu Jun 17, 2021 5:27 am Interesting Jim, I find it somewhat difficult to relate these malefic PVP aspects to the life of Boyd Chart. What is your take?

I've been thinking about this since I posted the breakdown above.

First - giving an easy answer - if this is a correct chart for the event, it's our first declaration of war chart. It's, therefore, accurate to show it in a hellish way.

The bigger question to my mind, though, is whether this is the best chart to describe the United States overall. Realizing these aspects are the strongest and most dominant forces in the chart strengthens my view that this is not at all "the true horoscope of the United States" (as the book's title claims) but, perhaps, just a side chart for certain kinds of predictive phenomena.

If we do accept this chart as the "true horoscope of the United States," it unequivocally portrays the U.S. as the most violent, murderous, destructive, horrible, hateful, poisonous nation in the history of the world. Now, I know there are people who would say this is true, and most thinking and informed people would say that, yeah, as a nation we've had our dark side and been guilty of atrocities. I'm not ready to accept that this description fits at this magnitude, though. For example, I'm not ready to accept that the U.S., taken across the whole of its history and impact, has been more violet, murderous, destructive, horrible, hateful, poisonous, and source of atrocities than, say, Nazi Germany.

Of course, there may come a time that I have to change my mind about that. I don't think that time will come: Our history or atrocities stand out because they are exceptions to what is primarily a different kind of history. This is more consistent with, say, the Declaration of Independence chart, which shows a mix of strengths and weaknesses, a mix of nobility and corruption, a mix of showing leadership and effecting positive events and yet being authors of atrocity. This mix seems a far more correct portrayal (and certainly a more faithful portrayal of our professed values).

Jim wrote:

First - giving an easy answer - if this is a correct chart for the event, it's our first declaration of war chart. It's, therefore, accurate to show it in a hellish way.

Yes, I do believe the Boyd Chart is an accurate timed chart timing “hellish” events in USA History.
Jim wrote:

The bigger question to my mind, though, is whether this is the best chart to describe the United States overall. Realizing these aspects are the strongest and most dominant forces in the chart strengthens my view that this is not at all "the true horoscope of the United States" (as the book's title claims) but, perhaps, just a side chart for certain kinds of predictive phenomena.

I understand and agree---a side chart for seeing the “hellish” events. Mundane Astrology is a fascinating study using Sidereal Astrology Principles along with Solar Arcs, and my study of this chart has proved its mundane value for me.

I want to test Fagan’s following words with the Boyd Chart pertaining to the faster moving transiting planet of Mars:

Transits and the Lunar Return. In regard to the more rapidly moving planets, their transits only become significant if they should closely configure the birth planets on the date of a lunar return. For example, if Mars should be in exact opposition, conjunction, or to a lesser extent, square the radical sun on the date of a lunar return there will be a liability of an accident, hurt or illness. Otherwise such a transit may pass without anything untoward occurring. So it is always advisable to note all the transits to the birth planets, especially to the natal moon, that are exact or nearly so, on the date of a lunar return for they are certain to be effective. Indeed the Indian Janma-Rasi method of monthly prediction, which has proved so astonishingly successful, was probably originally based on such transits. Cyril Fagan

On Boyd’s Oct 20th Demi SLR for next week, t. Mars is 28,07 Virgo, 1,10 conjunct Boyd’s Natal Moon, calculating the above criteria of Fagan's words. During the time frame of this Demi SLR, t Mars will exactly square t Pluto with t Pluto partile 90 Boyd’s Natal Moon. I want to see if this transiting Mars excites a Mars-Pluto like event/incident for the USA. If a Mars-Pluto type event does manifest during the time frame of this Demi SLR, I then want to pay particular attention to Boyd’s “outstanding incident” Moon-Pluto Nov 3rd SLR. Boyd’s Nov 3 Mundo SLR calculates a Moon-Venus Paran. I am testing here—not predicting.

Here is an absolutely stunning example with the USA Boyd Chart for Danica’s (member of forum) annual Solar-Lunar methodology, which I think belongs in all the world’s astrological journals as the possibility for the best discovery or re-discovery for the 21st Century. A Solar-Lunar chart is when the t Sun exactly conjuncts the Natal Moon. This example clearly demonstrates with acute timing the beginning of the Civil War in the USA using the progressed Solar Quotidian charts (daily chart-a Sidereal Astrology method). It’s an “outstanding incident” (a-Jim Eshelman teaching) Mercury-Mars chart known by Siderealists as par-excellent symbolism for war-like-disputed incidents. Ebertin says for negative Mercury-Mars combos:

The stage of getting into controversies, the bringing about of disputes.

Wikipedia says:

At 4:30 a.m. on April 12, 1861, Confederate troops fired on Fort Sumter in South Carolina's Charleston Harbor. Less than 34 hours later, Union forces surrendered. Traditionally, this event has been used to mark the beginning of the Civil War.

1860 Solar-Lunar:
https://ibb.co/gtTyny6

Please note the angular partile 90 square for Mercury-Mars! Also note the partile Venus-Saturn conjunction. Also, very important to note with the well-known Sidereal Astrology technique for Q2 Solar Quotidians (Daily Charts), Solar-Lunar (SL) Moon will progress to partile aspects of conjunction to SL progressed Mercury and partile 90 progressed SL Mars. This is a key because this happened to be the time (April 12 1861) when the USA Civil War began, along with a partile 180 of progressed SL Mercury-Pluto, and a partile 90 of p Moon to p Pluto. Fagan, Bradley, Firebrace, and the host of this Forum Jim Eshelman have always taught the importance of partile aspects with Solar Quotidians Moons for timing important events. Please allow your eyes to see this outstanding progressed Solar-Lunar Quotidian Chart (link below) with these partile aspects of:

p. Moon 15,25 Lib
p. Mercury 15,17 Lib
p. Mars 15,11 Cap
p. Pluto 15,59 Ari

We can clearly see where the progression of 1860 p SL Moon timed the beginning of the Civil War on April 12, 1861 when it matured its partile aspects to Mercury-Mars-Pluto. This is truly an outstanding partile aspected SL Quotidian Chart for the beginning of the Civil War, filled with partile aspects.

April 12 1861 SL Quotidian:
https://ibb.co/qC4MVcV

I've used the Marr rectification chart for the USA, but I am of the opinion that there can be more than one chart, as relating to a whole country.

I decided to check the Topocentric Primary Directions using the Boyd Chart for Apr 12, 1861

Neptune sesquisquare Sun 0° 0'
Saturn semisquare Pluto 0° 1'
Mars opposite Uranus 0° 4'

Primary Directions are based on the primary (ie. rotational) movement of the Earth, so don't lose sight of the fact that the Mars opp Uranus aspect is a "once in a lifetime," it's nothing like transiting Mars that comes around every 2 years.

James wrote:

Primary Directions are based on the primary (ie. rotational) movement of the Earth, so don't lose sight of the fact that the Mars opp Uranus aspect is a "once in a lifetime," it's nothing like transiting Mars that comes around every 2 years.

Interesting James. I know little of your astrology you practice but recognize it as a branch of astrology. If you like when you have time, maybe in a designated topic area approved by Jim-- post us your keener insights what you have learned from your branch of astrology.

Thanks, Steve

My main point by sharing that was that the one time that the primary direction Mars opposite Uranus formed in the Boyd chart, was tightly timed to the start of the Civil War. ie. The primary directions in a system I am familiar working in, made a picture perfect direction, so to me is helping corroborate the Boyd chart.

Yes, no problem at all, I understood exactly where you were coming from James. I only mentioned another possible topic with your work for my possible learning curve, since I know so little about your systems of astrology. Do you have charts of other nations? Maybe we could look at em with Danica's SLs.