Jupiter-Neptune & Saturn-Uranus

[Jim Eshelman]

We are currently in a few weeks when two outer-planet soft aspects exist. I thought I'd draw attention to this to see what people might observe in the news. (I admit I am so friend on the number of intense aspects weaving in and out of ingresses and Trump's personal charts that it's hard for me to see clearly something distinguishing this particular time for others around it.)

One aspect is Jupiter trine Neptune. The other is Saturn trine Uranus. There is an interesting symmetry in these two belief-oriented planets and the other two hard-edge reality planets; yet the Greater Benefic aspects a soft malefic while the Greater Malefic aspects a soft benefic.

Both of these aspects are within 3° July 12 to September 7. They are closest in early August. They loop Pluto into the picture (sextile Jupiter) August 23 and, after Neptune departs, continues as Jupiter-Pluto + Saturn-Uranus to September 28.

In mundane astrology, JUPITER-NEPTUNE aspects usually indicate events of powerful inspiration, faith, and idealism; compelling surreal optimism; belief-driven motivation and decision-making (often religious-themed); powerful opposing belief and bigotry; excess, over-abundance, immoderation, glut; entertainment themes (box office bonanzas, record-breaking movie attendance; for events that were not fun, festive, or celebratory, it typically signals an entertainment-themed setting).

SATURN-URANUS aspects in mundane astrology usually join themes of Loss + Explosion along with a bubble-bursting forced confrontation with harsh reality. Expect tension; wide swings between various opposites (e.g., freedom-restriction, liberality-conservatism; struggle between forces of change and the status quo), with political and practical gridlock until one side gains dominance.

Each, also, reflects the entire scope of psychological principles we otherwise expect from these aspects in, say, natal charts. With their coexistence, we might expect a joining of the principles of social idealism, faith & belief, unreasoning optimism (Jupiter-Neptune) with autonomy, ingenuity, harsh reality, constraint vs. freedom (Saturn-Uranus).


Except... there's more. With combined aspects, there are hidden patterns. Specifically, anytime two planets have about the same separation (e.g., two trines of about the same orb), you get a cross-over midpoint pattern. In this case, with Jupiter trine Neptune and Saturn trine Uranus, e find that the Saturn/Neptune midpoint conjoins the Jupiter/Uranus midpoint! So we can also expect themes of progress, achievement through atypical paths, surprising luck with themes of tenuous boundaries, narrowing options, renunciation, grief.

[Jim Eshelman]

So… what do you observe about the time that matches these themes in collaboration?

[Arena]

With this it is once again the same theme as usually in astrology, that most of the time there are more themes at play at the same time. F.ex. in my case tr. Nep & Jup also aspect my n. Moon, Sat, Mer & Ur. I believe my resignation from my company and breaking ties completely with business partner is coming up, as in Nep-Sat removal theme also with Pluto on n. angle.

Nep-Jup is perhaps felt in my psyche as I am contemplating on the higher power, universal energy and reincarnation. I am contemplating on and exploring the possibility of a dimension beyond what I can touch and see.

Must add that of course I've often done so before, but I feel this is a theme now in my life, it's coming up in so many conversations and perhaps I am becoming more willing to believe without seeing.

[Jim Eshelman]

But in terms of mundane astrology - political and geopolitical implications, for example - how do you see this working in the world?

[Arena]

Aha, I see now that this is posted in mundane astrology. Am on phone so vision is impaired.
Simple answer, I don't. I am not following all world events or where these planets are angular, I.e. more relevant...so I wouldn't know.

[SteveS]

Jim asked:

But in terms of mundane astrology - political and geopolitical implications, for example - how do you see this working in the world?

With a little help from my colleague Ebertin's work for Jupiter-Neptune & Saturn-Uranus combined with DC's Moon- Neptune Cansolar, my best guess: Speculative plans which amount to nothing associated with geopolitical tensions/burdens. If manifests with world markets: A breakout to the downside with the realization of false market hopes.

[Jim Eshelman]

Thanks. Do you actually see this happening? What I'm hoping to drag out of everyone is their observations about what is actually happening (since this "zone" is already about a week old) that we see in our headlines and around us.

[SteveS]

I am really not paying much attention to the news/headlines today. I did pay attention to the news/headlines when the June 12-13 eclipse cnj Capsolar MC 180 t. Pluto, and clearly saw political tensions flare in the news. What are you reading Jim with these aspects in the heavens?

[Jim Eshelman]

I'm not yet. That's why I through it out to the rest of the forum as a puzzle to wrangle. I have to keep my attention on the regular monthly forecast (Moon is about to enter Capricorn, and my deal with myself is not to have everything about the period written before the period begins).

But Ptolemaic aspects among outer planets is a basic tool of traditional (including traditional among Siderealists) mundane forecasting. I don't think they approach the precision of the ingresses, but we shouldn't be ignoring them. When I saw these two overlapping, I thought I'd stir some activity from everyone while we're passing through them.

[Lance]

Well, it depends on if the trend keeps up.

But (Saturn-Uranus): Trump is disappointing a lot of people who are starting to see through his obfuscation on Russian hacking. Gowdy said the evidence more than fulfills the burden of proof.

And (Jupiter-Neptune): The Democratic Progressives are starting to ramp up promotion of their far-left wish list.

Each may have a kernel of the other in it as well. Dems may find they don’t have the support. Trump fans are fanning the flames, holding out hope.

Maybe the theme is fanning the flames of hope / holding on to hope while events begin to burst the bubble.

Just brainstorming.

[Veronica]

So… what do you observe about the time that matches these themes in collaboration?

God Save the Queen

When I read this I thought about the Monarchy and then when you said Pluto. I got sad when I saw Pluto.

I hope Im wrong but she cant live forever

[Veronica]

I will be super sad when the Queen dies.

I looked at her chart and didnt like pluto on the acs.

Shes like a spiritual mother to me,
my mom would say about cleaning the house
you never know, the queen might stop by

most americans dont have any good feelings for Her and thats too bad.
when she dies, we wont have another real Queen
and thats too bad
shes a beautiful archtype and human being

[SteveS]

I like your brainstorming Lance.

[Jim Eshelman]

One thing we might expect from past research is the stock market going up for this time. (I make this observation only in terms of these aspects, not weighing in anything else that might affect it.)

The published research of LCDR David Smith in the '50s and '60s showed that (at least up to that time) a strong correlation existed between any trines or sextiles between Jupiter, Saturn, and Uranus - such as the current Saturn-Uranus trine - and stock market climbs. Similarly, Jupiter-Neptune trines had not so much a true value increase by the speculative climb we've been used to seeing from stronger Jupiter-Neptune combinations.

[Veronica]

I read in the news that some politician made some very ugly words about the head of the "Be Best" movement, Melania trump.

when I thought about this event I was reminded of you asking this question, remembering that it would be at just about this time you said was gonna be hitting.

I have strong feelings for her and a lot of respect and admiration for all her talents which I think are not expressed to the public. She is a very powerful woman in her own right and for him to sexually marginalize what she has accomplished in her life, regardless of her husband, and inspite of him at times, is very demonstrative of the patricarical system that has been kicking and screaming its whole existance.


that man better hope he doesnt run into me or I will make him cry for trying to undignify her as a human being.