Veronica

sotonye · Post by **sotonye** » Tue Dec 04, 2018 8:29 pm

Hello Veronica, how is your back doing? I read a little while ago that it wasn't feeling alright and so I'm checking up on you

Veronica · Post by **Veronica** » Tue Dec 04, 2018 9:24 pm

Hi Sotonye,
Thanks for asking. My injury to my cervical bones in my neck was relieved by the cortisol injections I recieved a few months ago though the procedure was excruciating for me and something I do not want to do again. Hopefully I will not have to go through that again anytime soon. My workers comp case is still open (I didnt except the 30k they offered as a cash settlement bc my dr said I shouldnt incase I need further treatment down the long road of my life). The injection I recieved to my shoulder didnt help and seemed to make the pain worse. It hurts a lot and sleeping is the worst. Thats when it seems to get cold and stiff and just is horrid. My dr says I need surgery but Im having issues with workers comp paying for treatment as the original diagnosis did not include both shoulders. So Im struggling with stupud mundane roadblocks to get medical treatment.
I decided Im just going to fix it myself and have in the past year cut out all alcohol and its been 3 months sinceh I used cannabis ( which my one dr had said could be helpful ...to relax. Ive cut back cigarettes to less then 10 a day and Im doing an hour of yoga in the morning.
Its a slow process. I think a lot of my pain in my shoulder is from emotional issues and from when I was assulted last year bc the woman did pummel me pretty hard.
I think I will get over it soon though. Its been feeling better and if I have to do yoga for the rest of my life thats fine, Im a better person when I take care of me anyways.
Ive been in some severly co dependant relationships and Im just sick in the head and heart about all the secrets and lies I put myself through denying to myself who these men (My husband and Craig) really are and what thier needs and drives are. Eric will keep beating his girlfriends in a drunken self loathing rage against his homophobia and Craig....well...that another story.
Life is pain but suffering is optional. I was built to endure more pain then most, for a reason. Maybe its so that other people will be able to live the life they need and want without fear of being harrassed, persecuted and tortured. I dont know. But a little shoulder pain is nothing compared to the psycholigical pain that those men endure by not being able to ve themselves.
Thanks for asking. I am blessed to be alive and to be able to feel pain and pleasure so Im doing pretty good.

SteveS · Post by **SteveS** » Wed Dec 05, 2018 4:51 am

Veronica wrote:

I love to dance. I love all kinds of dance.

Me too. Any kind of dancing usually begins with some kind of good music, both belonging to the arts and acting as benefics for our souls.

Veronica · Post by **Veronica** » Wed Dec 05, 2018 5:20 am

Funny...
My cousin last night just returned one of my books I lent her...five years ago..._When Woman Were Drummers_.
Which is a beautiful herstory of the origins of music. Of course the first beat we all groove to as humans is the heartbeat. And breathe of our mother and before that I would say it would be the pulse of the Cosmos itself.

Im hoping that now that I no longer have asthma and am working out and quitting smoking that my endurance to dance will just get stronger.

I heard a story of a man who was addicted to heroin who danced his way clean. He makes music himself and his songs are some that really get me pumping and mooving.

The first 10 seconds of this make me think of a drag race starting....https://youtu.be/R0tITMsafgY

SteveS · Post by **SteveS** » Wed Dec 05, 2018 6:57 am

Veronica wrote:

The first 10 seconds of this make me think of a drag race starting..

Veronica! You are too young to remember the boggle woogie dancing, but when I was a teen in junior high school, we used to go to the corner drug store and put a dime in the juke box and play this piano tune over and over and dance the boggle in front of the jukebox, not as good as the dancers in the following video---but still---you understand where I am coming from.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J9b3ZZywQvg

Veronica · Post by **Veronica** » Wed Dec 05, 2018 7:44 am

Lol
Steve
I grew up with a Wurlitzer Jukebox in my kitchen that my dad won pkaying poker at a bar. My mom filled it with. Boogie woogie and swing 45s. My parents danced a lot when I was really young. It was kinda like a piggy bank for me. We could earn dimes doing chores and then play a tune.

SteveS · Post by **SteveS** » Wed Dec 05, 2018 8:59 am

Veronica, we gotta love youtube! Its the closest thing we have serving us as a time machine to go back and visit the past during our good days.

Veronica · Post by **Veronica** » Wed Dec 05, 2018 1:34 pm

I do love youtube.
Its a good way to lift our spirits on bad days too.
But I find the kind words of caring friends even better on those days.
Thank you.

sotonye · Post by **sotonye** » Thu Dec 06, 2018 4:09 pm

Veronica wrote: Tue Dec 04, 2018 9:24 pm I decided Im just going to fix it myself and have in the past year cut out all alcohol and its been 3 months sinceh I used cannabis ( which my one dr had said could be helpful ...to relax. Ive cut back cigarettes to less then 10 a day and Im doing an hour of yoga in the morning.
Its a slow process. I think a lot of my pain in my shoulder is from emotional issues and from when I was assulted last year bc the woman did pummel me pretty hard.
I think I will get over it soon though. Its been feeling better and if I have to do yoga for the rest of my life thats fine, Im a better person when I take care of me anyways.
Ive been in some severly co dependant relationships and Im just sick in the head and heart about all the secrets and lies I put myself through denying to myself who these men (My husband and Craig) really are and what thier needs and drives are. Eric will keep beating his girlfriends in a drunken self loathing rage against his homophobia and Craig....well...that another story.
Life is pain but suffering is optional. I was built to endure more pain then most, for a reason. Maybe its so that other people will be able to live the life they need and want without fear of being harrassed, persecuted and tortured. I dont know. But a little shoulder pain is nothing compared to the psycholigical pain that those men endure by not being able to ve themselves.
Thanks for asking. I am blessed to be alive and to be able to feel pain and pleasure so Im doing pretty good.

I'm impressed with and proud of you for taking matters into your own hands in this way! This is so good dude! I'm sorry to hear that the injection to your shoulder made matters worse and that these men messed with your heart, but I am glad to see how strong you are in spite of everything. An indomitable spirit you've got

Veronica · Post by **Veronica** » Thu Dec 06, 2018 5:00 pm

Dude

We all have access to indomitable spirit.
Im just not afraid to tap into it.

Thanks for your incouraging words.
Sorry to hear about your back pain as well.
Your very young
I would suggest that you look into yoga yourself.
It teaches balance harmony and obviously union.
I learned it was best for me to use mundane tools first.
Ie
Pray as if everything relies on god
Yet
Work as if everything relies on you

Having oogie boogies at your back door is not fun fad or fashion. Just my personal expierence talking.

Ill tell ya too...
I firmly believe that I was/am a willing participant in all the "bad" and all the "good" things in my life. Yet when an event is fresh it is sometimes difficult to maintain that awareness amungst the noises of the world, so it feels/seems like the "other" did something "to" me.
That is weakness of the mind. The wandering mind ....distracted by the egoistic duality our physical bodies are living in.

When I am living in truth
I know those guys didnt do anything but try thier best to stay alive and fulfill thier own destiny. Even if they purposely tried to be mean....if I am clear of mind....they cant hurt me. No one can.
The same is true for everyone.

Life is just noise to distract our senses so our soul can focus harder .

Veronica · Post by **Veronica** » Sat Dec 08, 2018 11:58 am

In an effort to try and rise above some subconscious programs I have been running I recalled the conversation in my sons chart about what was going on with me during my pregnancy. I am very interested in this idea because from my understanding during pregnancy the feelings and thoughts of the mother are biologically passed to the fetus/child via hormones such as serotonin, adrenalin and dopamine.
Those chemicals lay a foundation for the developing child that are strong indicators for future development, behaviors, traits and core psychological issues.
I do see in Sidreal astrology a strong correlation between planetary character istics, aspects, anglularity and midpoints and the biochemical make up of a person and I do also see in my own chart and the charts of my siblings and offspring a strong relationship between the environmental influences the carrying mother was in/conditioned under as well as her progressed charts and the transits that were occuring during fetal development.
Since it is believed that we humans are running on subconscious programming 95% of the time and only consciously engaged with the current world 5% of the time, it would seem to me that any attempt to rewrite/ over come negative subconscious programs would have to delve into just what environmental factors, feelings, beliefs and thoughts were being expierenced by the mother during gestation.

I can look at my charts all day and say...this is that and this is so but Im beginning to believe that it doesnt serve me as well as if I can say...ok Veronica, your a nasty b itch sometimes and thats because biologically you are predisposed to have a lot of stress hormones and low serotin which occured during your original cellular growth/dna activation because your mom was flooding your system with those chemicals because that was what was going on in her reality during your formation.
My birth chart seems to be more of a record of what was happening to her during that time. As my childrens charts seem to a record of what I was going through at that time.
The reason that I am entertaining this thought is because for years I did things thinking that if I recycled my paper and bought organic and other mundane things that by sheer ripple effect I could in my own way lift mankind out of what I saw as a downward strife filled suffering that has my brothers and sisters of the world living in a lie, and running and hiding from reality. But thats me, that was the subconscious program that was written in my stars and reflected in my dna via the Butterfly Net my mother was living in.
I read Steve and Jims remarks of the saturn influence I was under during my sons gestation and was struck by how much that is him and I recalled a book I read as a teen in which a couple was trying to bring forth a child of love and light and so the mother to be was to be surrounded by beauty and harmony.
Its hard in this world to create those conditions and to be mindful and conscious all the time of every thought and feeling that arises and to not let our meandering mind dwell in unhealthy patterns of thought.
Does anyone have any thoughts on this or have resources I can look into in this.

Its very challenging to try and pull out subconscious programs, to get all the roots and germs out. I dont know if its entirely possible but as I look at my kids and think of my potential grandkids it would be nice to be able to build a healthy fertile rich earth, and to nurture any seeds planted in a way that allows the will of that soul incarnating to blossom to its potential. I do know in my heart that all souls come from a source of love and they are perfect as is so maybe this is all just vanity.
Its hard to see the 8year olds modeling behaviors at school that they learned from thier parents and just smile and trust that the best thing is to just love them anyways.

Veronica · Post by **Veronica** » Mon Dec 10, 2018 12:09 pm

is the 4th harmonic chart a good representation or accurate as a midpoint chart?

Im not finding anything on this site to clue me in how to read into that chart but I did see elsewhere mention that they were similiar.

Post by **Jim Eshelman** » Mon Dec 10, 2018 12:56 pm

Veronica wrote: Mon Dec 10, 2018 12:09 pm is the 4th harmonic chart a good representation or accurate as a midpoint chart?

Yes. It's actually the same as a 90° dial, and will give you all aspects to midpoints down to 45° series.

The chart will look essentially the same as a 90° dial.

Veronica · Post by **Veronica** » Mon Dec 10, 2018 1:31 pm

Thanks!

I thought it might be because that 90 degree list matched perfectly from what I recalled.

Veronica · Post by **Veronica** » Wed Dec 12, 2018 2:48 pm

It appears this month I might have a sad lunar return.

From what I see pluto is near the ic square uranus which is opposite venus.
As well as mars/neptune partile conjunct square my sun and jupiter which is close to my moon and mercury all in scorpio.

For several months I have been thinking that my dad is leaving us soon....hes pretty bad off. I offered to have him move in with me....

I also think my little puppy Pippi Longstocking doesnt have much time and the quality of her life is pretty bad. I may have to have her put down...or something...Im not one to let others do what I see is my job/responsibility.

I hope Im wrong about my dad. He is obviously not going to California for the winter so this will be the first holiday season with him in almost 20 years.

Ive never really tried to read my lunar return so I was kinda shook by what it seems to be telling me. Maybe Im reading it wrong.

Post by **Jim Eshelman** » Wed Dec 12, 2018 3:10 pm

Where are you living now? Still in Rochester? Let me know. It does have a lot going on and the biggest signals are of change of some sort. Picking Rochester, I work it up thus:

t Pluto sq. Asc +0°40'
t Uranus on WP -0°43' [op. non-foreground Venus 3°06']
r Uranus on Asc +6°37'
-- t Pluto sq. r Uranus 1°38' in mundo

t Moon-Jupiter conj. 3°27'
t Sun-Neptune sq. 0°24' (Mars 1°13')
t Mars-Neptune sq. 0°49'
t Jupiter conj. r Jupiter 0°42'

So the main message is one of change - dramatic reorientation, really. Then, within this, there are background messages that are supplemental. The Sun-Mars-Neptune trio is partile yet background, so probably shows background toxic factors in your life. Mingled with this is Jupiter's return to its natal place and its middleground conjunction with your Moon. Combining the basic meaning of the chart with the cyclicity nature of the Jupiter Return, the reorientation in your life is a reframing of your ideas around Jupiter themes such as prosperity, status, job, cultural inclusion, etc., with the opportunity to reframe how you approach these for the next six to twelve years.

Veronica · Post by **Veronica** » Thu Dec 13, 2018 1:25 am

I sent you my exact location. But Rochester is pretty close.
I have been feeling this Jupiter return as well. I love my job working in the library with the kids so much, but the pay is horrid. Id make more money at McDonalds.

I dug out my copy of Let Your Life Speak last week.
Looking for that place where my greatest happiness meets the worlds greatest needs...if I recall that quote correctly.

Im not a money girl though, but here in a world that demands you pay your way.

I want to grow violets and flowers and make the world pretty and smell nice, and take care of children.

There is a lot of things toxic in my background. I have to cut out sufar and caffeine and tobacco. Bad habits I recently picked up but make me feel yucky about myself. I also have uncomfortable feelings with my younger brother who said mean hurtful things and wouldnt help me when I asked. I have to go to his house for Christmas and I dont want to. My car is about to die and needs tires . and just stupid stuff but I take things to heart and have trouble not over feeling things.

This morning though, as I sat on my porch at 3am waking up a beautiful Vixen came walking by and I said hello and good morning and she stopped and sat and looked at me as she scratched her ear. I told her to be careful crossing the street. She walked away and thrn about 3 minutes later her mate came and I said hello and good morning and he stopped too and looked at me for a moment before he trotted off after her.

So that was a blessing and I was happy and grateful and knew I can handle these turning wheels I got spinning in the sky, because, well I am a Unicorn and I can talk to animals and thats special and I know it even if others think Im crazy or too much to handle.

Thu Dec 13, 2018 8:37 am

I have to go to his house for Christmas and I dont want to.

No you don't.

Call his house up a half hour before you're supposed to be there and say you can't make it to whoever answers the phone. Don't say why, just you won't be there. "I can't make it. I know you must be busy. I won't keep you. We'll talk later." Then hang up, and take the phone off the hook. Enjoy your day.

Veronica · Post by **Veronica** » Thu Dec 13, 2018 9:22 am

Ive thought about that.
Your right I dont have to do anything I dont want to.
I never have. No one makes me do anything I dont want to.
Yet my kids seem to want to go.
I will see how my day is.
I do take things one day at a time.

Thanks

Veronica · Post by **Veronica** » Sun Dec 16, 2018 9:24 am

That partile sun neptune mars brought about an event Friday that for me I would say is background toxic.

I have been feeling some car issues coming. I could use some new tires, a balance and I had a issue with my battery a month or so ago which in a way cut my ties with my brother who is a mechanic. Long story short I paid him for a battery, which he stole from his shop...and the shop called me to pay.....dad n I went down and set that straight, but Im not taking my car there again.

So...anyways. Friday night I went to take my girl and her friend shopping and my battery light came on. My tires make my car shimy a bit and I knew it had either shimmied my cables loose or my alternator, whoes belt has been very grumpy, threw the belt. I knew if I shut off the car I wouldnt get it started, and I have allready used all my AAA up. So via cell my girl arranged a ride from the mall, for her and her friend and I dropped them off and was driving home. My lights were just about dead.
Got home and sure enough car wouldnt start. It was dark and I didnt have a flash light so I used my phone light while I tried to take out my battery so I could bring it in the house to charge it. I usex to have a 200 foot extension cord but my brother had taken it. So....well the bolts were locked tight and my shoulder hurt and my phone died.
Yup.
So I took a nice hot bath and figured I would try again in tbe morning. I had to pick up my girl downtown by 11am. So I figured if worse came to worse shed have to take an uber or something.
In the morning I thought long and hard about what should I do. Should I call triple a and by a battery from them and tbey would take out my stuck one for me? Should I call my dad and have him have it towed to tbe dealer so they can just fix the door handles, windows, battery, tires and possibly the alternator? Which would run hundreds of dollars....my head was swimming. Then I though about what Craig would do. Hed wait till it was light and try again to do tbe cheapest easiest thing which would be get the battery out and charge it and see if that got it running. If a fully charged battery didnt start it then Id know it was the alternator. I called my sister and told her I needed to borrow dads car to pick up my girl and she needed to come get me. Dad wont be using his car. Probably ever and he td me before i could use it.
I am still very angry with her for gossiping about me and Friday my daughter read me texts my sisters daughter had sent her that were cruel uncalled for nasty lies and selfish childish bulling words (shes 21 my daughter is 16) so I was pretty angry about that too but I called her anyways and just told her she had to puck me up. (She owes my close to 1k in loans I will never collect).

So I had the ride lined up for my kid so she wasnt stuck in the hood alone.

I said a prayer and got my good ratchet and socket and went out and busted my knuckles getting that darn battery out. But I did it.

Put it on the charger overnight.

And this morning in a cold drizzly rain I put it back in and the dam car wouldnt start. I was not happy. But I didnt cry. I thought again what would Craig do. He wouldnt cry. Hed try again. So I got out and cleaned up tge termi als more and tightened thrm down as best I could. And this time...it started. And I crowed "mommy is a f%#&@ rock star" cause I am.

That aspect was background for me because while it was a yucky event and gave me bit of blood n grease it was nothing really major that I couldnt handle when I stay calm and patient and think and not let my emotions get the better of me.

For many other people that would have been a forground event. But I have a well stocked tool box and great help.

My dad always asks me... " why dont you ask so n so for help? Youve helped them Im sure they would help you..."

And I smile and think of my angular Pluto and reply....
"Ill see if I cant do it myself. Id rather save those karma point (his term for good deeds) for something I cant do on my own, like a back rub or stratching an itch I cant reach."

SteveS · Post by **SteveS** » Sun Dec 16, 2018 10:26 am

Good work V.

Avshalom Binyamin · Post by **Avshalom Binyamin** » Sun Dec 16, 2018 10:47 am

Yeah!

That's alchemy!

Veronica · Post by **Veronica** » Sun Dec 16, 2018 1:13 pm

Thanks!
Ha!
Turning lead into gold.....
Thats what alchemy is all about.
There is lead in batteries.

But I see now what the distinction between foreground and background events can mean, and that was my point in sharing because I have trouble with those finer points.

Im still feeling this partile....

I had to pick up my son who was away this week, consoling his friend whoes father had a cocaine and alchol induced heartattack and died...very sad event.
I had a few hours this morning before then so I went to my dads nd had planned on cleaning for him as a thank you for letting me use his car. I had cleaned for about an hour when I heard him calling to me.
Well...he was bad off. His visiting nurse apoarently had been there in days and his foot was compketely necroptic and septic and the imfection was up to his thigh....and OMG he smelled horrid.
It was horrible. The strongest man I know reduced to a frail ghost on deaths door....
I bathed him and wrapped up his feet in fresh bandages and called my sister to take him to the hospital bc I had to go pick up my daughter from work.
I didnt cry. I didnt lie to him when asked how it was. I didnt get angry at my sister and niece for lying to me that they had changed his bandages....I just loving washed him up and dressed him and made him some food and packed his bags and gave him a kiss and told him he was going back to the hospital and they will do what needs to be done and he isnt going to die in the hospital that I will make sure he comes home and can die when he is ready...in him n moms bed like he wants.
He was happy and didnt fight like he is want to do with me.

So thats partile background. And attitude awaremess and being present in the moment make a big difference

If it was forground It would be something directly happening to me, like getting punched in the head by a crazy lady or getting angry and breaking a window.

Veronica · Post by **Veronica** » Mon Dec 17, 2018 5:10 am

Veronica wrote: Mon Jun 25, 2018 2:38 pm On June 13 I received some threatening texts from my ex husband. *8:30 pm and 8:35 NY*
in clear violation on the order of protection.

In these texts it appears as if he has continued to cyber stalk me, and has been reading this forum gathering who knows what kind of info to use against me. the things he said in the text he would have no way of knowing with out reading my posts here as far as I can tell.

When I took him to court on the 7th of June for an increase in child support he asked to have it postpone so he could hire a lawyer. which I know he will not do and is playing with the courts like always.

on June 14 after thinking it overnite, I called the police, and they arrested him.

Tonite at 7pm he is in court and the DA says he is going to ask for the max.

I had a gut feeling that he was reading my posts here and at another site I like, it has made me scared to open up here even though I have had several big things going on.

I feel horrible about him peeping and all and I am very sorry Mr Eshelman and to you all.

Just wanted to give an update on this:
Friday I recieved a letter from the courts about this violation. He was charged with comtempt of court and disorderly conduct, and my order of protection (which was to expire in Jan.) Was extended two years, with no contact at all.
My kids were very relieved.

I also go to court this morning for my final (hopefully) time regarding the childrens child support. He had it bumped up to family court on the defense he shouldnt pay anything since he isnt seeing the kids.....(mind you he was court ordered to go to rehab and anger mangement which he never did, and to fullfill the grounds of my order of protection-which he didnt. And to not have contact with police, which getting arrested for beating up his gf.....so yea)

Well he never showed up and that was his shot to have his dide heard.

So yea....more background sun mars neptune toxic stuff, but hopeful this Jupiter return will see an increase for my babes, maybe some of the 5k arrears he owes and who knows....

Also on a happy note that did make me cry...
The lions club gave me over $100 worth of food on saturday. My old cubscout friend runs it and thought me n the kids would like some nice food for the holidays.

Yea!! I love good food.

FlorencedeZ. · Post by **FlorencedeZ.** » Mon Dec 17, 2018 5:52 am

That is so nice to read Veronica that your old friend from the lions club gave you and the kids over $100 worth of food on saturday.
And what a relief for you all that your order of protection was extended for two more years with no contact.
Really great for you, happy december

Veronica · Post by **Veronica** » Mon Dec 17, 2018 7:32 am

It was great, thanks for the encouraging words!
I put up my holiday lights too so yes it is a happy December. I hope yours is happy too!

Veronica · Post by **Veronica** » Mon Dec 17, 2018 12:42 pm

Well I have been up since 1 am thinking all sort of crazy things, my head is in a real fog, and court and owrk are like a blurr. Its almost like I am coming down with a head cole.

So He never showed up for court, so I guess th ekids won. The referee said she will mail her decision in 4 weeks, but for sure I am getting at least $180, plus arrears. so its $60 more and that is helpful.

looked at my chart.
Transiting Mercury is conjunct my Natal neptune
explains the head fog and the wierd supernatural thoughts I woke up with.

going home and going to bed to make suer its not a head cold. I have to see my dad and I cant risk giving him germs! He will be in the hospital for christmas, so, so will I. much rather go about the hospital singng songs to sick people then hanging out with my siblings.

so yea court is over, so happy about that. I hate going there. cost me almost ten bucks to park!

Veronica · Post by **Veronica** » Fri Dec 21, 2018 12:49 am

I believe it is my Jovial Jupiter hugging my moon and Neptune that blesses me so deeply at this, the darkest time of the year.

The winter solstice is my favorite Holiday for in my world it is the Holiest of Holy.

It is this time when instead of looking around my chart to see what the planets and luminaries are doing, I focus on the angles. I focus on the center and the Cross that is there in each and every chart of each and everyone of us.

I saw meteors these past three days and one so bright tonight it lit up the whole sky.

I know why Jim said Aquarian moons are the best now.
We will have a full moon on Saturday and lots more shooting stars. Im not a very good astrologer because Im too sensetive and reactive but I know how to overcome that. I ask myself...WWJD.

What would Jim have said if it was Craig who sent a request to the list for help understand himself and his relationships? Would have said discouraging things or used words to confuse or mislead or give false hope? Not at all. Jim is a man who has spent his life helping men overcome themselves and push and challenge themselves and to be exactly what they are.

Thats an Aquarian moon. He takes the miraculous light from the Son and shines it out in Brotherhood. He uses the teachings and mysteries of the Holy Cross itself to encourage and lift up mankind.

I hope you all have a Blessed Solstice a very Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year each and everyday because everyday is a blessing and a gift no matter what is going on around your chart. Its the immaculate heart in the center of the cross that is the most important.

Where there is love there is life.

https://www.cnn.com/travel/article/wint ... index.html

https://youtu.be/_sEP5_7DMu0

This is my favorite holiday song and it does bring me to my knees and make me cry. And thats a good thing in my world.

SteveS · Post by **SteveS** » Fri Dec 21, 2018 5:59 am

Happy Holidays to you Veronica and your family. Springville is supposed to have a crystal clear night on the Winter Solstice. I will be sure to go to my favorite viewing area of the night skies to see this rising Full Moon. Thanks for the links.

Veronica · Post by **Veronica** » Sat Dec 22, 2018 12:28 pm

I have been reading and thinking of the Saggitarius traits for this months moon discussion.
I resonate deeply with this sign on a deeper level.
At first I thought it was because for years I used tropical astrology which placed my moon neptune jupiter and mars in that sign.
Yet as we know, thats not true and does not mirror my true nature at all.
I have my Venus in Sag. Though at 20 degrees.
I was struck by something Steve said to me in kindness when I was being moody and grumpy about my break up with Craig.
He talked about my midpoints. Some thing I had no knowledge or real understanding of. Outer understanding anyways. Obviously we all have an innate understanding of ourselves....but put on. Airs and masks and consume things( drugs alcohol sugar flour tv media popular culture gossip on other peoples beluefs ect) so we can fit in to society and survive.
I think the reason that I resonate so deeply with the Saggitarius traits and Jupiter themes is because of my midpoints. I almost think at times those midpoints are a stronger indicator of my true self then my sun and moon signs and my angluar pluto. In fact it seems to me that those aspects are more of a by product of my midpoints...like a reversal.
My midpoints were listed here in this thread previously so I wont bang them all out again but I am, as my nature says, looking into that mirror and trying to see just what I am. It seems very rare that I have a huge collection of midpoints dancing around my Venus in Saggitarius.
I cant seem to find anything on line or in that midpoint book about just whats thats all about.
I guess maybe that means Im the one who would know just what having so many midpoints all conjuct Venus is about.
I did look into my solar return charts for when my venus aspect was forming in my ego and i saw at 4 years old my solar return had venus conjuct jupiter. Its wierd and fascinating in a way.
It really opened my eyes to how much I need harmony and beauty and friends and a loving romance and the deep deep need to have another to be in love with.
Thats where the pain in my gut comes from when I dont feel like Craig cares and never getting to love him again comes from. I need a puppy.
I literally feel in love with a puppy the other day at the store. I wanted it so bad. It made me cry. I dont really want a puppy or a baby or flowers those are symbols.

So if anyone has any feed back on my huge collection of midpoints around my sag. Venus and just what that is about Id like some feedback.

Is it stronger then my luminaries and angles?
Is it more senseitive to transits and returns
Is it the source of my soul

It feels like it is
But maybe thats the chocolate talking

Veronica · Post by **Veronica** » Sat Dec 22, 2018 3:34 pm

Hmmm.....
My 16yr daughter who is a libra and her venus is in libra
Just said to me
" you have to lower your expectations of people. You see people through your heart as the best they can be, but there only people, with pain and troubles that keep them down and they dont see themselves the way you do. You keep getting your feelings hurt because they dont live up to your hope for them, you gotta let them hope for themselves, and lower your expectations."

Pretty accurate summation, I was moved by her depth of understanding and her ability to say all that with love.

SteveS · Post by **SteveS** » Sat Dec 22, 2018 3:49 pm

Veronica asked:

So if anyone has any feed back on my huge collection of midpoints around my sag. Venus and just what that is about Id like some feedback.

Veronica, I have some feedback pertaining to your Natal Venus and how it is wired with midpoint structures into your Natal Soul. Understand, I learned most of what I know about Midpoints from Robert Hand’s extensive research and knowledge about Midpoints. I am certainly no expert on Midpoints, but I consider Robert Hand to be an expert on Midpoints.

Without a doubt, Robert Hand would consider by his teachings the most important midpoint for your entire Natal Chart is a direct midpoint of Venus/Mars=Asc (0,59 orb/partile). Robert Hand would consider this midpoint the most dominating soul influence in your entire Natal Chart. Pluto is directly involved in this midpoint simply because Pluto partile squares your Natal Asc partile 90 your Venus/Mars midpoint. So, what we have here is a very strong Venus/Mars/Pluto influence in your Natal Soul. I can only go by your posts, but I think this means your soul strongly feels this Mars/Pluto influence but there is a strong Venus love influence associated with this principle of Mars-Pluto. I think your feelings are strongly influenced with this midpoint combo with Craig. There are no books which offer a four part principle for Venus/Mars/Pluto/=Asc, but Ebertin’s Midpoint read for Venus/Mars=Asc is:

A lively expression of feelings, an affectionate nature. The revelation of love, a physical union.

But, you see, we have to put Pluto in the mix with Ebertin’s above words with Venus/Mars/=Asc. Its somewhat a very important complex structure for your Natal Soul. IMO, it has to do with your deep love for Craig, yet Craig has treated you in a rough Mars/Pluto manner. Jim could probably understand better than I by combining the correct words for this Venus/Mars/Pluto=Asc in your life, Jim knows you better than I.

I hope I was able to help in some ways for you understanding better why you strongly feel/react to your Natal Soul with this very important midpoint structure of Venus/Mars/Pluto=Asc as a dominating factor in your life.

Veronica · Post by **Veronica** » Sat Dec 22, 2018 5:41 pm

Thanks Steve
You have helped me quite a bit.
Why do you say the midpoint of venus/mars is my asc and not Decendant? The planets are in my 7th and 6th house so wouldnt it be closer to the dec.? Does it not matter because that is the horizon line? So its actually both?
It is happier sounding to say asc. Espically when the master of soul work Pluto is involved.
Thank you for sharing your insight. This midpoint has been a factor/influence my whole life via dreams and urges and feelings that seemingly come out of no where and are overpoweringly strong and have really come to the surafce since my relationship with Craig. I even see in our synastry chart how his placements have impacted on my chart and all its nitty gritty stuff. Funny how the universe brings people together for what ever bigger plan it has. Very fitting.

SteveS · Post by **SteveS** » Sun Dec 23, 2018 5:02 am

Veronica wrote and asked:

Why do you say the midpoint of venus/mars is my asc and not Decendant? The planets are in my 7th and 6th house so wouldnt it be closer to the dec.? Does it not matter because that is the horizon line? So its actually both?

An excellent and valid point Veronica. In the Ebertin/German schools of Midpoint Astrology, they did not recognize/delineate the Dsc or IC for symbolic purposes, only using the Asc & MC in their writings, so yes, ‘it’s actually both.’ In your Natal Chart, I think we definitely need to allow more focus on your DSC symbolizing close relationships involving husbands and other(s) close relationships, which makes perfect sense to me with Venus/Mars/Pluto being wrapped into your Dsc as the dominating midpoint structure in your Natal.

Veronica wrote:

Funny how the universe brings people together for what ever bigger plan it has. Very fitting.

Exactly! An excellent point. IMO, the greatest mystery ever involving human 'relationships' on our planet Earth.

Veronica · Post by **Veronica** » Sun Dec 23, 2018 11:41 am

Steve said

But, you see, we have to put Pluto in the mix with Ebertin’s above words with Venus/Mars/=Asc. Its somewhat a very important complex structure for your Natal Soul. IMO, it has to do with your deep love for Craig, yet Craig has treated you in a rough Mars/Pluto manner. Jim could probably understand better than I by combining the correct words for this Venus/Mars/Pluto=Asc in your life, Jim knows you better than I.

I dont believe Craig has treated me in a rough mars/pluto manner. Im the one with this aspect. If anything Craigs pluto/ venus conjunction aspecting my charts contents would indicate he has been anything but the mean mars/pluto that I have been.

Craig is a beast of a man I will give him that but for the most part he turns that beast on himself. Self sabatoging in a way but concidering his total life expierence and nature and nurtue under his own stars and there movements....he makes the best of what he has and he has made a very successful life for himself against some very big odds.

Eric was mean to me. Eric plotted ways to be mean and cruel and hurt me and others.

Craig, while extremely impressionable from his friends, despies meanniess and cruelty. I can be mean and cruel. Im the one with venus/mars/pluto action. I am lucky though that my venus has a lot of other action coming at her, espicially the Understanding from Saturn and Originality from Uranus so that I can express and give the loving giving harmony instead of a severed head.

Jim would probably tell me that the blending of pluto. And all those other midpoints in that area is a very fascinating point. Of the conception of love energies brought forth in a highly individuaistic way for the benefit of mankind..... Maybe

SteveS · Post by **SteveS** » Sun Dec 23, 2018 3:31 pm

I think I got Eric & Craig mixed-up, sorry. With Eric being a former husband, probably the main manifestation/symbolism for the Venus/Mars/Pluto=DSC.

Veronica · Post by **Veronica** » Sun Dec 23, 2018 5:38 pm

Eric has a mars/venus conjunction in taurus on my asc square our conjunct plutos, as well his moon conjunct my mars in scorpio.....so I think that dynamic was overkill for us both. Almost literally.
If he was sober and able to be in conscious control of his conjunction he might develope the positve self esteem and self love that his soul seems to crave. But he dwells on pain and suffering and all the ugly things in the world.
Maybe if he moves somewhere else he could be happier and not fantasize about hurting people and himself. Idk.
I know it was the scarriest time of my life. I still tip toe through my own home out of subconscious fears of waking him, and I cry about all my journals he ruined and things my mom bought me that he would break out of meanness.
But if I look at his charts.. his solar returns through his life, and his mothers and pause, I can let it go and trust again that the universe does know what its doing.

Even though Craig and I arnt together, that was the happiest times Ive ever had with a man, and I wouldnt have those nice memories if I hadnt had that crazy time with Eric. So thats good. Im thankful I lived through it and thankful for good friends like Jim who helped me and cared enough to listen and encourage me to think of someone besides myself (like that venus/mars=dec iswant to do) and focus on taking care of my kids, my true vocation.

SteveS · Post by **SteveS** » Mon Dec 24, 2018 5:22 am

Veronica wrote:

Eric has a mars/venus conjunction in taurus on my asc square our conjunct plutos, as well his moon conjunct my mars in scorpio.....so I think that dynamic was overkill for us both.

Indeed Veronica, an 'overkill'. An excellent example of a malefic composite midpoint between two people.

Veronica wrote:

Im thankful I lived through it and thankful for good friends like Jim who helped me and cared enough to listen and encourage me…

I understand Veronica. There was a time in my life where I was in an excellent position to reached out and help battered women and children (mentally/physically), so I can relate to that type situation. And with Jim’s Aquarius Moon--- no better astrologer to understand the emotional needs for someone like yourself who experienced the harsh relationship you had with Eric. A good astrology 'friend' to have in your life.

Veronica · Post by **Veronica** » Mon Dec 24, 2018 4:31 pm

SteveS wrote: Sun Dec 23, 2018 3:31 pm . With Eric being a former husband, probably the main manifestation/symbolism for the Venus/Mars/Pluto=DSC.

Eh....
I dont think so.

If I understand the true analysis of this aspect midpoint,
Which I concider the uniting/balancing/yoga of the anima/aminus and bringing into conception a higher form of love.....

Eric wanted to kill me because I had this potential that he did not have the capacity to utilize. He hated me and hates me and all I love to this day.

Love death sex marriage union conception are all finely intertwined. I think the main mainfestation of this aspect is the concept of me personaly united my anima/animus and loving myself as best I xan and bringing for into the world the concept that you shouldnt just go jumping into bed with people. You should understand them as a soul first.

Veronica · Post by **Veronica** » Tue Dec 25, 2018 4:41 pm

SteveS wrote: Mon Dec 24, 2018 5:22 am Veronica wrote:
Eric has a mars/venus conjunction in taurus on my asc square our conjunct plutos, as well his moon conjunct my mars in scorpio.....so I think that dynamic was overkill for us both.
Indeed Veronica, an 'overkill'. An excellent example of a malefic composite midpoint between two people.

Veronica wrote:
Im thankful I lived through it and thankful for good friends like Jim who helped me and cared enough to listen and encourage me…
I understand Veronica. There was a time in my life where I was in an excellent position to reached out and help battered women and children (mentally/physically), so I can relate to that type situation. And with Jim’s Aquarius Moon--- no better astrologer to understand the emotional needs for someone like yourself who experienced the harsh relationship you had with Eric. A good astrology 'friend' to have in your life.

Ill tell ya what,
Jim taught me to keep looking.

Astrology as demonstrated by Jims methods and practice causes a person to be able to stop in the middle of an event and breathe and know that the event of the momeny is part od a bigger and more complex picture, a pucture layered with other events and circumstances.

Eric has been contacting Sabrina via facebook. She is very upset, and rightfully so because the language he is using is stark and harsh cold and of a very ineundo of threats.

Now in the past my blood would have curled and would be run amuck with fear and anger and confusion and general upset. Today I just told her to block him and ignore him as he was obviously drunk and in a bad emotional state. I pulled up his chart and liw and behold he has transiting uranus opposite his asc and venus/mars which is squared by T mars and a bunch of other things that have got him all up in his feelings. I showed it to her (she is very good with astrology) and she wiped her tears away and said "its still creepy and wrong"

It is, but it will pass. Or he will pass out and tomorrows another day.

The nice thing I have learned about astrology is that if stop and pause and look at the event you can change the outcome by realizing you still have a choice in how you choose to respond to events.

Bullies have a background and a reason they act out. But that doesnt mean we have to tit for tat. Sometimes we can just ignore it an know tgat a new wave of transits is coming along and we shouldnt waste our time engaging in behaviors that do not serve our higher purpose.

Veronica · Post by **Veronica** » Fri Dec 28, 2018 10:08 am

I peeked into my next years solar return.

The part I am curious about right now is my. Return Jupiter.
If I am here in Rochester area it is partile conjunct my mars.
That seems nice.
But I was curious if It could be better if I relocated my chart to a place where Jupiter would be on my Descendant? Its fairly close and I was thinking if I took a little trip I could bump it up.
Yet it also seems like I would loose some other nice things...like it aspecting my natal Uranus and Mercury.

I really would love a bit of financial independence and sucess which an angular Jupiter could enhance.

Post by **Jim Eshelman** » Fri Dec 28, 2018 11:39 am

Veronica, are you perhaps looking at the SSR around the outside of your natal chart? I ask because transiting Jupiter in the SSR is near your natal Descendant. In the SSR, it's closer to the IC.

Natal Pluto is rising in the SSR, and transiting Jupiter (on your Mars) is just over 7° east of IC. You could place it exactly on IC if you spent your birthday at a longitude just a tiny bit west of the Indiana-Ohio border. (I give you that location just for reverence - it could be anywhere due north-south on that line). This is also the Georgia-Alabama border for the lower half of Georgia. You can draw this on a map and see various places.

Atlanta isn't far from there, for example. Or Chattanooga.

Or you could have Jupiter square Ascendant a bit west of there. This line cuts just west of Indianapolis and just east of Chicago, on a curve that reaches roughly through Steve's back yard in Alabama down to the Florida panhandle.

Just avoid putting that Venus-Saturn (+Pluto) conjunction (on your Venus) on the angles

I'd also de-emphasize the Mercury-Neptune conjunction.

Fri Dec 28, 2018 1:22 pm

In my experience, Jupiter conj Mars, any combination of transit, progressed or natal, means money comes in and goes right back out, sometimes without stopping to pay down the bills.

Post by **Jim Eshelman** » Fri Dec 28, 2018 1:47 pm

Jupiter Sets at Dawn wrote: Fri Dec 28, 2018 1:22 pm In my experience, Jupiter conj Mars, any combination of transit, progressed or natal, means money comes in and goes right back out, sometimes without stopping to pay down the bills.

I see that with Mars transiting Jupiter, or with Mars and Jupiter equal (e.g., two natals in aspect or two transits in aspect).

Fir Jupiter transiting Mars, the mean feature is enhancement and strengthening of Mars expression, e.g., athletic or other competitive excellence, business success, sexual or other physical exuberance, etc. As a secondary effect, this level of WINNING confidence can lead to indulgence (hence over-spending), but it's a secondary (and less frequent effect).

In contrast, when a natal Mars-Jupiter is foreground, it means all the above plus extravagance etc. If transiting Mars and Jupiter are in aspect near, say Lunar Return angles then one has the same "money to burn" instinct or the world is burning it for you (expenses etc.). And so on.

Veronica · Post by **Veronica** » Fri Dec 28, 2018 2:22 pm

Ya know,

Ive had it up to the top of my head with mercury neptune aspects and was pretty shook when I saw that conjunction. I was like " really? I dont need that one bit"
Then I got a look at venus/saturn pluto and well....that made me forget about the first....

I really need open clear honest real communication. More then any jupiter stuff. Much much more.

You told me once I live on a mercury line. Thats why downtown we have a statue of Hermes crowning our town.

How far and what way would I have to go to break apart that conjunction enough? Ill start walking now if I have to

Veronica · Post by **Veronica** » Fri Dec 28, 2018 6:01 pm

Jupiter Sets at Dawn wrote: Fri Dec 28, 2018 1:22 pm In my experience, Jupiter conj Mars, any combination of transit, progressed or natal, means money comes in and goes right back out, sometimes without stopping to pay down the bills.

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Im pretty good at paying my bills first, but I will keep this in mind. Thanks.
I do feel what Jim is saying though because his input actually resonates with some goals I am working towards with my yoga practice and some others physical things that I am planning on implementing which should bring about a nice big turn around in my personal life and finances.
I am a double hub after all.

Veronica · Post by **Veronica** » Fri Dec 28, 2018 6:15 pm

Hmmmm.....

Did you know that the magical powers of a unicorn can actually force two planets out of a conjunction.....

Yea me neither.

Unless I go to the moon (i cant cast a chart for me on the moon....dont even know where to start with that)
All over the globe those two planets are still hugging tight.

So it looks like in my Solar return I am stuck with that conjunction.

Had a good laugh at myself though.
Like before
In the beginning of the year
When I got all excited about this wonderful placement in the sky.....its this month.....and I was like....wow how cool the moon and sun are gonna be conjunct.....and then about an hour later it hit me....duh....its an eclipse.
Freaking blonde....
I do have that " naive" aspect

I do understand how to de emphasize neptune mercury.

I have a very beautiful sun moon opposition, one of my most beautiful solar returns in my life actually.
I was given that.....its rare and special and should be emphasized. It needs to be emphasized. Thats why its there.

Oh and btw....
As a double hub with my nicely progressed being....
I can see that saturn/venus pluto matrix of energies manifesting in way not really articulated in the terminology but in my case.....

Im finally gonna get a big fat round bum.

Yup
Go figure that for disfigurement. That what happrns to women my age when our bodies change.

Avshalom Binyamin · Post by **Avshalom Binyamin** » Fri Dec 28, 2018 6:27 pm

I had a Mars Jupiter transit, and knew i was going to be spending money, so tried to spend in a way that saved long term.

It manifested as: my gym has been raising rates and cutting services, so I quit and joined a different gym, where i put cash down, but now pay significantly less per month going forward.

Veronica · Post by **Veronica** » Sat Dec 29, 2018 6:33 am

Jim Eshelman wrote: Fri Dec 28, 2018 11:39 am Veronica, are you perhaps looking at the SSR around the outside of your natal chart? I ask because transiting Jupiter in the SSR is near your natal Descendant. In the SSR, it's closer to the IC.

Just avoid putting that Venus-Saturn (+Pluto) conjunction (on your Venus) on the angles I'd also de-emphasize the Mercury-Neptune conjunction.

Yea, I was looking at them both on the same chart.

I do/did see transiting Jupiter on my Descendant.

You know me....allways ruminating and thinking deep about stuff, trying to see every angle and get the best understanding.

But then I always pull back to my heart and where my true sight comes from.

I have lived my life trusting that a higher power is actually running this show and I am but a small part in a bigger play. When I act through my mind and thoughts, I am asserting and exaulting my ego, which implies by the nature of ego that I know what is best.
I dont.
I know that the best things in my life have come to me, magically, unplanned, unconcieved by me as if by some magnetic force or gravitational pull of forces beyond my weaker will and ego driven desires.
When I let go and surrender and trust that this higher power has got not only my back, but my front and above and below and all my nooks and cranies inbetween....
I can be in the center of the biggest Uranian storm and be ok with that.

I told my daughter about my prediction for my venus/saturn pluto.....
She said
"Omg you must be so excited, youll look great with a big fat a ss"

Veronica · Post by **Veronica** » Sat Dec 29, 2018 6:37 am

Avshalom Binyamin wrote: Fri Dec 28, 2018 6:27 pm I had a Mars Jupiter transit, and knew i was going to be spending money, so tried to spend in a way that saved long term.

It manifested as: my gym has been raising rates and cutting services, so I quit and joined a different gym, where i put cash down, but now pay significantly less per month going forward.

very cool Bro! Gives me a few ideas and actually coincides with some of the plans I have been working toward to bring not only more vitality strenght and health but cash.....and an olympic size pool to swim in.