Finding the Ideal Place to Land

[blossomintobeing]

This isn't at the top of my list at the moment, but I was taught through traditional astrology to look at aspects to the angles from the planets to determine ideal spots to live.

I've learned to avoid Saturn aspects (even positive ones), and squares (although now I know better).

In the sidereal perspective, what would be the ideal planets and aspects to live under? I imagine Jupiter, of course, Venus, Moon, Sun, and avoid Saturn and Mars?

Is it really that simple?

[Jupiter Sets at Dawn]

I avoid Neptune, and most people don't like the constant surprises under Uranus, and Pluto might not lead you to a homey place.

But yes, it is that simple. You can get the lines all mapped out for you on astro.com

[Jim Eshelman]

This isn't at the top of my list at the moment, but I was taught through traditional astrology to look at aspects to the angles from the planets to determine ideal spots to live.

I've learned to avoid Saturn aspects (even positive ones), and squares (although now I know better).

In the sidereal perspective, what would be the ideal planets and aspects to live under? I imagine Jupiter, of course, Venus, Moon, Sun, and avoid Saturn and Mars?

Is it really that simple?

Yeah, pretty much. Except remember what we discussed about aspects to angles not existing (But "squares to the angle" are really other angles.)

[Danica]

The default-tendency, for most of people, would be: avoid pain, seek pleasure, so - seek places where the Jupiter, Venus, Sun, Uranus are, or ideally a combo of those, if you happen to have such a spot.

But in reality, things are more complex, because there are charts (personalities) whose core-themes and primary needs for experience are along the lines of Mars, Saturn, Neptune symbolism. Put those people in conditions of ease, ongoing pleasure and no much opportunity for struggle, and the result will not be Happiness, in authentic sense (for themselves, as well as their environment).

I think the best approach is: understand the Natal chart you're looking at, and then advise the person accordingly. Inform them about their Ju,Ve, Ur lines, as well as their Ma, Sa, Ne lines/places (and the interesting combos of those, etc). It's their decision to make, in each case, based on understanding of own needs and character.

One thing, though, I think is universally Good in a way that it can be taken as a rule: living on your Sun line, i.e. at a place where you get to express the Sun as the primary way of interaction with the immediate environment. People who's solar aspects of their nature are undeveloped will, of course, experience the beginning of the relocation time at such place as not-so-pleasant; but in the long run, it's a place that puts you in position to most fully and openly Be & Express Yourself, whatever that is and may entail.

So, my approach is to encourage people: Seek your own wholeness and authenticity, as ultimate goal.
The hardships and the easiness are all part of the Wheel - none of them can be truly avoided, while incarnated.

Also, in addition to what natal planets come to angles at different locations, it's useful to take a look at the general tone of the SSRs, say, for 5-10 years, for the area - depending on how long one intends to live there, etc; in short, take into account all the practical considerations (this may be not so relevant if someone is able to travel every year anywhere across the globe, and each time choose some particular, different location; but, say, if you relocate to a place and have something that binds you to the area, like a job, a house with animals and permacultural design to tend to , etc - then this is good to have an overview of in advance).

[blossomintobeing]

Here are maps showing your planet lines for the U.S. (they're large enough that I want to come back and delete them later, so please feel free to save off the images for your reference.)

The first shows where planets are mundanely on the horizon and meridian. The second shows the ecliptical squares to MC and Asc. Close contacts are 150-200 miles from each line; super close contacts are 50-60 miles from each line.

I just downloaded both images to my computer. Thanks for that!

[blossomintobeing]

But in reality, things are more complex, because there are charts (personalities) whose core-themes and primary needs for experience are along the lines of Mars, Saturn, Neptune symbolism. Put those people in conditions of ease, ongoing pleasure and no much opportunity for struggle, and the result will not be Happiness, in authentic sense (for themselves, as well as their environment).

Interesting perspective! How would I know if I was someone whose "core-themes" and "primary needs for experience" are strongly Saturnian?

For example, I have an exalted Saturn in my chart... but it's nowhere near the angles. However, my son's Mars is relatively close to his Ascendant, (his Neptune is tightly conjunct his Descendant) and his Saturn is tightly aspecting three of his major planets (Venus, Sun and Jupiter).

So, it may be fair to say he has more of a need for that type of challenge? Don't like to read that and I certainly don't WANT that... but I do tend to want clarity and understanding in all matters.

[Jupiter Sets at Dawn]

Interesting perspective! How would I know if I was someone whose "core-themes" and "primary needs for experience" are strongly Saturnian?
For example, I have an exalted Saturn in my chart... but it's nowhere near the angles.

You'd go back to this thread in which Jim worked up your chart for you.

However, my son's Mars is relatively close to his Ascendant, (his Neptune is tightly conjunct his Descendant) and his Saturn is tightly aspecting three of his major planets (Venus, Sun and Jupiter).

Jim did a work-up on your son's chart as well. Maybe bookmark those threads?

Ancient astrology texts are full of catastrophizing, but most people just don't lead such exciting lives.

[blossomintobeing]

Thoughts on Chiron? I live near a Jupiter line here, but am directly underneath a Chiron line. Overall, I do attract blessings... but most of the time, I feel like my wound is front-and-center.

Haven't heard much about Chiron here.

[Jupiter Sets at Dawn]

We don't generally bother with asteroids here. Most of us examined them awhile ago and decided they weren't worth the trouble of computing their positions in charts. It's only since computerized charts have become common that really anybody bothers with them. I don't think there's much of any "there" there.

No comment on Chiron. (It seems significant but so minor I don't think anything is missed by neglecting it.)

Are you missing something you expected to see in the delineation of your chart Jim did?
What do you mean "but most of the time, I feel like my wound is front-and-center." ?
Did somebody hit you in the face or something? Or is this a spiritual wound?

[blossomintobeing]

Thanks Jupiter. I think Jim was thorough in answering my previous questions.

What I AM curious about, is what you two--Jupiter and Jim--think of Kauai as a potential relocation for my family. I grew up in the islands, and have been feeling very strongly pulled home again.

When I run the astrocartography for us in Kauai though, I don't see much that's special for ME there, but my son has Venus-DC running right through Kauai, and Jupiter-MC (great) and Saturn-IC (not so great) are off the coast of the Big Island... not far.

In my case though, I have almost nothing going on, except successive Saturn-IC, Pluto-IC and Mars-Asc off the coast of the Big Island, where my mother committed suicide. They're about 800-1,200 miles away from Kauai though, but I expect I'd feel their effects.

Interestingly, with Saturn and Pluto on the IC, I was almost primed to lose my mother or have something terrible happen to her.

Maybe not wise to move back, considering those aspects. Would hate to have my own mothering affected.

Curious about your thoughts on the topic? Are there other aspects I'm not seeing in the area? Would Kauai be far enough away from those lines to mitigate their effects? Or do they still matter?

[Danica]

But in reality, things are more complex, because there are charts (personalities) whose core-themes and primary needs for experience are along the lines of Mars, Saturn, Neptune symbolism. Put those people in conditions of ease, ongoing pleasure and no much opportunity for struggle, and the result will not be Happiness, in authentic sense (for themselves, as well as their environment).

Interesting perspective! How would I know if I was someone whose "core-themes" and "primary needs for experience" are strongly Saturnian?

For example, I have an exalted Saturn in my chart... but it's nowhere near the angles. However, my son's Mars is relatively close to his Ascendant, (his Neptune is tightly conjunct his Descendant) and his Saturn is tightly aspecting three of his major planets (Venus, Sun and Jupiter).

So, it may be fair to say he has more of a need for that type of challenge? Don't like to read that and I certainly don't WANT that... but I do tend to want clarity and understanding in all matters.

In your specific case - look at that (Leo)Su- (Tau)Mo-Ur-Ju angular, all shiny-radiant-joyous - that' not a chart of a person leaning toward, or particularly much needing, in any primary sense, austerity! On the contrary, it speaks of abundance that a natural royalty-kind-of-person has (both: needs, and has available, by the micro-macro, inner-outer symatries of dimensions ).
There is enough Saturn present in the chart to balance the Sun-Venus-Jovial tendencies with ability to be self-disciplined and stay grounded (the Sa-Pl being connected by aspect with Venus, of the inners, this Saturnian side is maybe most easily accessible through the natural devotion-loyalty theme...?).

As a general rule, the primary needs are depicted by the: Luminary signs and aspects, Angularity and Strongest (by orb) aspects in the chart, as such. That's the broad outline; in practice, each specific case is quite unique in how the ten basic clusters of needs are emphasized and inter-related (i.e. their combinations).

[Jupiter Sets at Dawn]

Why would you want to return to a place you feel is so inimical to you and of which you likely have sad memories? I think that's the main question here. Find a place that's good for both your son AND you. His mother being sad or uncomfortable is not good for his psyche. Why would you want to inflict that on him, especially in a place where he has Venus strong, so he associates Venus themes with sadness?

Put your own mask on first, then put your child's on. Children are more likely to survive and thrive when their parents are doing well.

That said, lines that are much more than 200 miles from are too far away to have much influence. Lines 800 - 1200 miles away are out of orb.

[blossomintobeing]

Beautiful, Danica. That you for that insightful share. I feel that, for sure. Even when I was growing up dirt poor, I lived in lush locations, had ample access to food, and always felt wealthy, even with technically "nothing."

Jupiter, I'm not clear on your response. Can you clarify?

Yes, as I said, the Big Island has sad memories of my mother. She did pass away there and I've spent many, many years healing that. I'm in good shape now. However, I asked about living in Kauai, not on the Big Island... which is hundreds of islands away on the opposite side of the island group.

You also said that the "orb" to Kauai is too wide, so I would not feel the effects then of Saturn, Pluto and Mars (which are about 800-1,200 miles away, give or take). The BIG ISLAND is only about 200-300 miles from those aspects, but Kauai is much further. But then you said that the area is "inimicable" to me...

Do you mean that Hawaii as a "whole" is "inimicable" to me because my mother died on one of its islands, even if that island is hundreds of miles away, or because the orb you reference actually is not far enough away and could affect me somehow?

The reason I asked about Kauai is because it's beautiful to me, and I love the area. As someone with Venus in my Ascendant, I'm nourished by beauty. I kind of need it. Real, natural, raw beauty. With Moon in Taurus, I thrive on that even more.

My only concern, however, is about any potential detriment from those aspects 800-1,200 miles away. (Or any others closer that I somehow don't see.)

As a parent, I'm a little bit of a "rock," so I'm not concerned about how that's going to go. I'd just like to be the best parent I can be. And that includes manifesting the best opportunities for myself at every turn without astrological resistance to me accomplishing what I'm here to accomplish on Planet Earth.

I'd like to live somewhere beautiful, to nourish my Venus. And if my son's Venus is running through Kauai, seems like we'd both be happy. Unless, of course... it's not the ideal location for me. Which it may not be. And hey, if that's the case... best I stay put or find somewhere better.

Not rushing either way. Not my style. Thanks.

[Jupiter Sets at Dawn]

I didn't say it was "inimicable" to you. You must have me confused with someone else.

You said your mother died in Hawaii. I have no idea which is the "big island" or that that isn't Kauai, or where your mother died. It sounded like you have sad memories of Hawaii. If you don't, good, but why bring it up?

Astrocartography (mundane) lines don't cover thousands of miles. About 200 miles is the furthest away from exact they hold influence. They're points, not wide zones of influence. You'll see us here planning to spend our solar returns as close to a specific exact line as possible. Jim spent some time around his solar return (or maybe it was Marion's I don't remember) in a parking lot because that's where he could get to the line. The closer, the stronger the influence.

[blossomintobeing]

I didn't say it was "inimicable" to you. You must have me confused with someone else.

You said your mother died in Hawaii. I have no idea which is the "big island" or that that isn't Kauai, or where your mother died. It sounded like you have sad memories of Hawaii. If you don't, good, but why bring it up?

I think it's perfectly valid that I brought it up. It proves the power that a combination of malefic lines (Saturn-Pluto-Mars in succession a few hundred miles from a locale) can have on a person's life and because it's specifically relevant to the topic at hand (moving to Hawaii).

I simply stated a fact ("my mom [died] there"), without reference to any of my feelings or memories about it. You responded with "Why would you want to return to a place you feel is so inimical to you?" (scroll up) and inferred again (quote above) that I have "sad" memories there.

I think it's easy for you to assume that it was "sad" or "inimicable" for me, but you simply don't know that to be true, do you. Generally, when addressing sensitive topics like this, it's safe not to place our own assumptions or projections about a fact another person shares. Either way, I can chalk it up to a misunderstanding and call it water under the bridge.

Astrocartography (mundane) lines don't cover thousands of miles. About 200 miles is the furthest away from exact they hold influence. They're points, not wide zones of influence.

Yeah. The Hawaiian island group spans several hundred miles. OK, so it wouldn't matter then. Why I asked. Thanks.

You'll see us here planning to spend our solar returns as close to a specific exact line as possible. Jim spent some time around his solar return (or maybe it was Marion's I don't remember) in a parking lot because that's where he could get to the line. The closer, the stronger the influence.

That's an amazing story. Jim, did you feel anything?

Either way, grateful for the wisdom I've gleaned so far from this excellent forum. Sidereal astrology is far too underrated.

Take care.

[Jim Eshelman]

It's not about feeling anything at that exact time. It's about the year that follows. The difference between a Saturn Pluto etc. versus a double Jupiter Uranus etc. is huge.

At the exact time, there is nothing we've ever sensed that hasn't arisen from the anticipation of the moment. For example, one year for Marion's moment of SSR, we were on a road in the middle of the night near a beach that was the exact spot: There was the sense of knowing that we'd planned to be in an exact spot as Earth rotated into a specific alignment with the rest of the cosmos. Same a year later when it was a daytime pulled off an unused road to wait near a particular tree, or the evening we sat in a school parking lot (as Jupiter said) waiting for the moment to com and go.

Next week, we are headed to a tiny town just below Big Sur for Marion's SSR (Lucia, CA). Not ideal, but far better than staying in LA.

At some point over the years, I began comparing this to an old, minor comic book hero, Adam Strange, who used to go to obscure and barely reachable parts of the globe to be there at an exact moment when a Zeta beam would strike from a distant, alien word and transport him there for a while. It does seem that we are chasing Zeta beams.