How do the Stars and Planets affect us?

[Utiseta]

This can be taken as a rhetorical question, but I am quite curious. How does all of this work? How do the Stars and Planets affect us at the time of our birth? Or, is it all completely irrelevant? I am interested in what you all think of this. Myself? I am only sure that I am unsure. I think this is all fascinating, but I am just enough of a realist to know that reality and fantasy aren't entirely mutually exclusive, nor entirely opposite of one another.

[Danica]

You may find this thread of interest!
viewtopic.php?f=8&t=1922&hilit=carter

[Jim Eshelman]

This can be taken as a rhetorical question, but I am quite curious. How does all of this work? How do the Stars and Planets affect us at the time of our birth? Or, is it all completely irrelevant? I am interested in what you all think of this.

I have three parts to my answer.

First, astrology's fundamental doctrine is: (1) Every intersection of time and space (i.e., each moment at each place) has a unique character. (2) Whatever arises out of a place-moment partakes of its nature.

Second, while the above (all by itself) explains the importance of the horoscope for the first breath, I would add further that I think there is an imprint - a stamp - upon the whole of our psyche, nervous system, etc. with that first breath.

Third, I think the most important shift in myself around this question was realizing that the causal mechanism (so-called) isn't part of the physical universe - at least as "physical" is usually understood. I addressed this in the Introduction (p. 22) of my book Visions & Voices. After discussion the Qabalistic theory of Four Worlds, I wrote (adding a few bracketed clarifications below):

I consider these Four Worlds to be as objective as any other categorized facts in science. Their distinctions are constitutional, even organic. They are so familiar to me that I have described them as much from personal experience as from traditional accounts. I emphasize this because I believe the Four Worlds model brings to astrology something it has never had: a clear, satisfying understanding of the mechanism of how astrology works.

Attractive as it may be to seek a physical basis for astrology, none has ever been found. Nor do I think we ever shall explain astrology with the physical sciences. It is the wrong place to look. Speaking in Qabalistic language, astrological influences are not rooted in Assiah [physical plane]. Rather, they exist in the World of Yetzirah [the so-called 'astral' plane or subtle level behind and supporting the physical universe].

Imagine: Astrological forces originating in that plane of existence that occultists have long insisted on calling astral! As explained above, it is “a world… of psychic realities and shifting tides, and of energies too subtle for physical sensation.”

I am certain that, in human affairs, the direct influence of astrological factors is on the psyche, especially on the field of sub-consciousness. The more deeply we understand the convergence of astrological patterns with individual and collective subconscious patterns, the more easily will we understand how astrology works. The impact of celestial influences on natural phenomena (from plant growth to earthquakes) is also best understood as an effect originating in this subtle, formative layer just behind physical existence. Everything I have ever observed or intuited about astrology’s individual, collective, and natural out-workings is con-firmed by this one explanation.

[Utiseta]

That's an interesting take. I was also considering that it could be part of what Jung called the Collective Unconscious. Then again, there's also the Chaos Magick concept of the Servitor at play there as well, I think. We can physically see the Stars and Planets, yet it's our subconscious that recognizes them as symbols. At least, that's what comes to mind when reading the excerpt you provided. Is this book available on Amazon? I must definitely check it out.

[Jim Eshelman]

That's an interesting take. I was also considering that it could be part of what Jung called the Collective Unconscious.

That leaves us to define exactly what that is, and I submit that it's no different than what I said, i.e., the substance of the World of Yetzirah ("astral plane") from which all symbols emerge.

We can physically see the Stars and Planets, yet it's our subconscious that recognizes them as symbols.

But we can't see all of them, and we can't see any of them all the time. Yet they are continuously operative.

At least, that's what comes to mind when reading the excerpt you provided. Is this book available on Amazon?

Yes. Or from the publisher directly. Here are some links:

http://thelema.org/publications/vv.html
https://www.amazon.com/Visions-Voices-A ... 1?dchild=1

[Veronica]

I wanted to share an thought I had.

I have had a few people confide in me, some on their death bed, that they were spies on a secret mission. some from God/Goddess, some from Satan, some from Aliens.

It was vitally important for them to share with me that for their entire life that have been gathering information and experiences to bring with them, and that every step of the way they kept this secret agenda close to heart and never told anyone.

it seems like, in a way that they were admitting in a way to having an affair/relationship that they didnt want anyone to know about.

my sister was one of them, and she and I talked quite openly about her mission.

one thing that she tried to explain to me was that as an Aquarius sun, my character and soul feels love towards all life, and that the reason that I get unbalanced is that I am not meeting people half way, or at their level of functioning, that I feel like I have to always be kind and turn the other cheek. she told me though, that I am wrong to do that, and that if people push me first I have every right to push back.

these ideas seem to fit with how Jim explained the dynamics of astrology.