GENERAL INTRODUCTION: Sidereal astrologers have rarely written at length about how to judge specific areas of life about which people may have recurring questions. Tropical astrologers dwell on this extensively, surely fortified by the idea (that may or may not be true) that different areas of life are "governed" by different houses.
Speaking for myself, I've not written about such topics extensively because my primary interest is exposing character and its unfolding. I disagree with the house-driven premise that we are drastically different in how we handle different parts of our lives. Instead, I find that, "How you are in one part of your life, so are you in all the parts of your life" - your inherent self ultimately shines through one way or the other. Therefore, my basic answer to any question of "How does this person act in the X part of his or her life?" or "Over the course of life, what is likely to happen to this person?" will always be: "Understand who this person is: That will tell you what you want to know."
Nonetheless, we do have ways of placing a magnifying glass over one or another area of life; we just haven't sharpened these tools. I propose to start a series of threads on different life areas. For each, I will post this introduction; then reserve the first reply space for me to post my primary answer (as I get around to it). The rest of the thread is wide open to discussion and contribution. (Over time, I will edit my premise-post with the idea of turning it into an instruction in the topic, fed by the discussion. You don't have to wait for my premise-post to post on the topic.)
Some will be tempted, based on the nature of these topics, to jump into the houses as a quick answer. As the thread is open to discussion, that's fine; but, as usual, my own opinion is that we should stick with techniques that we have proof work, which at this stage in astrology's unfolding would minimize or exclude the use of houses.
Everyone feel free to jump in!
Specialized Inquiries: Wealth & prosperity
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Jim Eshelman
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Jim Eshelman
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- Joined: Sun May 07, 2017 12:40 pm
Re: Wealth & prosperity
[Rewritten 5/10/2023]
A question such as, “Will I ever become filthy rich?” is better suited to a fortune teller than an astrologer. For astrology to honestly, accurately answer such questions, its answers must match the economic realities we find in the world. In economically developed countries:
Often people miss that prosper comes from a root meaning, “to be happy.” Prosperity is about happiness itself: The fact that the word has become attached to wealth arises from equating happiness with money. Mostly, in this chapter I will use prosperity in this familiar sense; but please keep its original meaning in mind as we go. At least one major astrological signal of possible extreme wealth is inconsistent with happiness per se, so we should not confuse them.
Astrological indicators of prosperity and wealth begin from the economic conditions into which one is born. People do rise from initial poverty to enormous wealth or fall from initial wealth into poverty, though most enormously wealthy people were born into it or into a middle-class family that provides opportunities and advantage.
In most respects, it matters little that Bill Gates’ horoscope has the most common signs of wealth. He was born into it. His chart goes on to suggest he would competitively build on his advantages and have significant impact, that he would do well compared to wherever he started.
It matters more what the charts of Steve Jobs or Warren Buffet say on the matter, since they were born in the economic middle. It matters a great deal what Oprah Winfrey’s chart says, since she rose from deep childhood poverty to become a self-created billionaire.
With respect to wealth, the horoscope especially shows what one is able and likely to do with what one has. Within this are outliers who fall far short of the possibility offered or exceed it far beyond expectation. Their outlier status usually shows in the nativity, especially through unusual strength of Pluto.
More important than initial wealth is early opportunity, especially through mentorship and connection. Access to mentorship often appears in the horoscope through unusual strength of Jupiter. However, sometimes it does not show directly – the astrological indicators are more complex, e.g., in how the chart connects to other people’s charts in one’s environment. Therefore, we need information about a person’s circumstances.
Other important matters shown by the horoscope include ambition, priorities, effort, and connection. Rather than assess prosperity from only a few targeted chart details, we need to uncover how a person views and manages resources and what is important to them in life, things evident from the general character assessment we obtain from the initial overview of a chart.
A question such as, “Will I ever become filthy rich?” is better suited to a fortune teller than an astrologer. For astrology to honestly, accurately answer such questions, its answers must match the economic realities we find in the world. In economically developed countries:
- Most people’s wealth falls somewhere in the vast middle between extremes of devastating poverty and inconceivably vast wealth.
- Most people remain in the same broad economic range into which they are born or migrate a little above or below it.
Often people miss that prosper comes from a root meaning, “to be happy.” Prosperity is about happiness itself: The fact that the word has become attached to wealth arises from equating happiness with money. Mostly, in this chapter I will use prosperity in this familiar sense; but please keep its original meaning in mind as we go. At least one major astrological signal of possible extreme wealth is inconsistent with happiness per se, so we should not confuse them.
Astrological indicators of prosperity and wealth begin from the economic conditions into which one is born. People do rise from initial poverty to enormous wealth or fall from initial wealth into poverty, though most enormously wealthy people were born into it or into a middle-class family that provides opportunities and advantage.
In most respects, it matters little that Bill Gates’ horoscope has the most common signs of wealth. He was born into it. His chart goes on to suggest he would competitively build on his advantages and have significant impact, that he would do well compared to wherever he started.
It matters more what the charts of Steve Jobs or Warren Buffet say on the matter, since they were born in the economic middle. It matters a great deal what Oprah Winfrey’s chart says, since she rose from deep childhood poverty to become a self-created billionaire.
With respect to wealth, the horoscope especially shows what one is able and likely to do with what one has. Within this are outliers who fall far short of the possibility offered or exceed it far beyond expectation. Their outlier status usually shows in the nativity, especially through unusual strength of Pluto.
More important than initial wealth is early opportunity, especially through mentorship and connection. Access to mentorship often appears in the horoscope through unusual strength of Jupiter. However, sometimes it does not show directly – the astrological indicators are more complex, e.g., in how the chart connects to other people’s charts in one’s environment. Therefore, we need information about a person’s circumstances.
Other important matters shown by the horoscope include ambition, priorities, effort, and connection. Rather than assess prosperity from only a few targeted chart details, we need to uncover how a person views and manages resources and what is important to them in life, things evident from the general character assessment we obtain from the initial overview of a chart.
Jim Eshelman
www.jeshelman.com
www.jeshelman.com
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Jim Eshelman
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Re: Wealth & prosperity
[Rewritten 5/10/2023]
Luminary Constellations
Sun and Moon constellations often give a starting point about one’s relationship to money. These traits are included in the luminary sign interpretations in Appendix A, sometimes explicitly and sometimes only inferred by related traits (e.g., Taurus’ love of simplicity, Sagittarius’ fondness for conspicuous status symbols, or Aries’ need for control and not to fall into someone’s debt). Sign distinctions are stronger for occupations than for money matters; yet Sun and Moon sign placements are so basic to our character that it is always a mistake to bypass them.
Speaking very generally, Rim luminaries have the most direct connection to finance. Money represents the sort of circulating energy (to which Rims most naturally attune) that makes things happen including propelling industry and the world of business. Each Rim constellation has its own characteristics (Capricorn and Aries are most connected to finance): The entwining of money, industry, and motion themes are common to all of them.
Getting vs. Keeping
Jupiter and Saturn signal complementary ways that we find resources in our possession. Jupiter favors receiving; Saturn favors retaining.
These two planets’ relative prominence reflects the balance of affluence or entitlement against earning or producing. Jupiter thrives in easy conditions as Saturn thrives in tough conditions. In short, Jupiter is good at getting it and Saturn at keeping it.
Strongly Jupiter types usually have an easier time in life. They are made for easy conditions and thrive best in them. Jupiter folks have more chances to receive more of the world’s bounty through opportunity and connection. However, without strong Saturn traits they usually do not hold onto what they get: Pure Jupiter enjoys spending and enjoyment, especially conspicuous spending and enjoyment.
That is a primary difference between Jupiter and Saturn: Jupiter is conspicuous. Saturn inconspicuous.
Jupiter feeds on the world’s bounty, favoring leisure, expecting providence and blessing, with a temperament better suited to a blessed life than one of hardship. A “wishing makes it so” form of faith triggers often surprising luck or advantage. Even if afflicted by malefics, a prominent Jupiter starts with an (often unconscious) assumption that the world should simply give them what they want, manifesting in envy or “making one’s own luck” through opportunism, shady ethics, or crime.
Strongly Saturn types, on the other hand, usually have a harder time. They are made to survive tough conditions and actually thrive best (feel most right about themselves) when they have to prove it. Saturn folks earn their share of the world’s resources through their own effort, rarely expecting automatic opportunity or lucky breaks. One speaks of shrewdness, labor, and perseverance or endurance for Saturn’s success rather than luck or opportunity. They are prudent, against conspicuous consumption and wasteful spending: Whatever they have, they are more likely to keep, if not hoard.
Saturn types without a similarly strong Jupiter need to be self-sufficient and self-reliant. They have stronger needs for material security and tend to manage their resources effectively, having a knack for “making things work” with what they have.
However, despite Jupiter’s and Saturn’s simplistic reputations, some Jupiter types have very little money simply because they do not hold onto it well, whereas Saturn sponsors the type of frugal stashing that sometimes leaves figurative mattresses laden with cash when they die. Saturn in us is also fond of enduring property such as real estate or at least investment in conservative bonds rather than the more Jupiterian leaning of playing (investing) in often volatile markets.
If Jupiter is strong in a nativity and Saturn’s presence is essentially absent, you likely will see more of the “pure” (one-sided) Jupiter type described above. With the opposite conditions, expect to see more of a “pure” Saturn type. If neither planet is strong, issues of prosperity and material security hold no unusual importance for the person.
Where getting and keeping come together, though, is when both Jupiter and Saturn are strong. People with both strong are more likely to accumulate wealth. Horoscopes of the most successful people usually have a mix of strong benefic and malefic energies because a mix of opportunity and advantage with labor and persistence most often drives success. Combining luck and hard work is usually well rewarded.
Competition and Business Sense
Speaking broadly, Mars, Jupiter, and Saturn are a business trio combining competition, luck, and prudent persistence. These three planets deserve particular attention if the business world is one’s target.
Strong Mars typically means a strongly competitive nature that seeks to prove itself in battle (including business). Mars tests itself, demonstrates and hones skill and power, seeking to improve its ranking. Thus, an angular Mars or close luminary-Mars aspect is common for executives and other highly competitive successful professionals.
Mars often signals significant income even in the absence of strong Jupiter or Saturn because of the competition motive. Money is a symbol of power. In fact, money shares much with Mars, being effectively a token of energy expended and a source and gauge of worldly power. Mars’ cosmic state accurately describes the strength of one’s need to compete and how effectively and successfully one does so.
In a more limited way, we can turn this Mars, Jupiter, and Saturn trio into a quartet by adding Mercury. Though some Mercury expressions are scattered or have short attention spans, more commonly Mercury foreground or conjunct Sun grants business knack and is natural in commerce (commerce, mercenary, and Mercury share a common root) and doing business. Whatever their particular field (including creative fields), angular Mercury types likely are good at managing the business aspect of it.
Luminary Constellations
Sun and Moon constellations often give a starting point about one’s relationship to money. These traits are included in the luminary sign interpretations in Appendix A, sometimes explicitly and sometimes only inferred by related traits (e.g., Taurus’ love of simplicity, Sagittarius’ fondness for conspicuous status symbols, or Aries’ need for control and not to fall into someone’s debt). Sign distinctions are stronger for occupations than for money matters; yet Sun and Moon sign placements are so basic to our character that it is always a mistake to bypass them.
Speaking very generally, Rim luminaries have the most direct connection to finance. Money represents the sort of circulating energy (to which Rims most naturally attune) that makes things happen including propelling industry and the world of business. Each Rim constellation has its own characteristics (Capricorn and Aries are most connected to finance): The entwining of money, industry, and motion themes are common to all of them.
Getting vs. Keeping
Jupiter and Saturn signal complementary ways that we find resources in our possession. Jupiter favors receiving; Saturn favors retaining.
These two planets’ relative prominence reflects the balance of affluence or entitlement against earning or producing. Jupiter thrives in easy conditions as Saturn thrives in tough conditions. In short, Jupiter is good at getting it and Saturn at keeping it.
Strongly Jupiter types usually have an easier time in life. They are made for easy conditions and thrive best in them. Jupiter folks have more chances to receive more of the world’s bounty through opportunity and connection. However, without strong Saturn traits they usually do not hold onto what they get: Pure Jupiter enjoys spending and enjoyment, especially conspicuous spending and enjoyment.
That is a primary difference between Jupiter and Saturn: Jupiter is conspicuous. Saturn inconspicuous.
Jupiter feeds on the world’s bounty, favoring leisure, expecting providence and blessing, with a temperament better suited to a blessed life than one of hardship. A “wishing makes it so” form of faith triggers often surprising luck or advantage. Even if afflicted by malefics, a prominent Jupiter starts with an (often unconscious) assumption that the world should simply give them what they want, manifesting in envy or “making one’s own luck” through opportunism, shady ethics, or crime.
Strongly Saturn types, on the other hand, usually have a harder time. They are made to survive tough conditions and actually thrive best (feel most right about themselves) when they have to prove it. Saturn folks earn their share of the world’s resources through their own effort, rarely expecting automatic opportunity or lucky breaks. One speaks of shrewdness, labor, and perseverance or endurance for Saturn’s success rather than luck or opportunity. They are prudent, against conspicuous consumption and wasteful spending: Whatever they have, they are more likely to keep, if not hoard.
Saturn types without a similarly strong Jupiter need to be self-sufficient and self-reliant. They have stronger needs for material security and tend to manage their resources effectively, having a knack for “making things work” with what they have.
However, despite Jupiter’s and Saturn’s simplistic reputations, some Jupiter types have very little money simply because they do not hold onto it well, whereas Saturn sponsors the type of frugal stashing that sometimes leaves figurative mattresses laden with cash when they die. Saturn in us is also fond of enduring property such as real estate or at least investment in conservative bonds rather than the more Jupiterian leaning of playing (investing) in often volatile markets.
If Jupiter is strong in a nativity and Saturn’s presence is essentially absent, you likely will see more of the “pure” (one-sided) Jupiter type described above. With the opposite conditions, expect to see more of a “pure” Saturn type. If neither planet is strong, issues of prosperity and material security hold no unusual importance for the person.
Where getting and keeping come together, though, is when both Jupiter and Saturn are strong. People with both strong are more likely to accumulate wealth. Horoscopes of the most successful people usually have a mix of strong benefic and malefic energies because a mix of opportunity and advantage with labor and persistence most often drives success. Combining luck and hard work is usually well rewarded.
Competition and Business Sense
Speaking broadly, Mars, Jupiter, and Saturn are a business trio combining competition, luck, and prudent persistence. These three planets deserve particular attention if the business world is one’s target.
Strong Mars typically means a strongly competitive nature that seeks to prove itself in battle (including business). Mars tests itself, demonstrates and hones skill and power, seeking to improve its ranking. Thus, an angular Mars or close luminary-Mars aspect is common for executives and other highly competitive successful professionals.
Mars often signals significant income even in the absence of strong Jupiter or Saturn because of the competition motive. Money is a symbol of power. In fact, money shares much with Mars, being effectively a token of energy expended and a source and gauge of worldly power. Mars’ cosmic state accurately describes the strength of one’s need to compete and how effectively and successfully one does so.
In a more limited way, we can turn this Mars, Jupiter, and Saturn trio into a quartet by adding Mercury. Though some Mercury expressions are scattered or have short attention spans, more commonly Mercury foreground or conjunct Sun grants business knack and is natural in commerce (commerce, mercenary, and Mercury share a common root) and doing business. Whatever their particular field (including creative fields), angular Mercury types likely are good at managing the business aspect of it.
Jim Eshelman
www.jeshelman.com
www.jeshelman.com
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Jim Eshelman
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Re: Wealth & prosperity
[Rewritten 5/10/2023]
Aspects for Wealth
Two aspects are unusually common in nativities of extremely wealthy people. Obviously, not everyone with these natal aspects becomes uber-wealthy – that would mean (limiting ourselves to Class 1 aspects) that as many as 13% of all people would be superrich. Nonetheless, in collections of charts of the wealthiest people, the frequency of these aspects far exceeds statistical expectation.
The two aspects are Venus-Saturn and, to a lesser extent, Jupiter-Pluto.
Venus-Saturn Aspects
Venus-Saturn is the most common aspect for great wealth. For example, close Venus-Saturn conjunctions, oppositions, and squares (the most distinctive for great wealth, whether earned or inherited) occurred at the births of Bill Gates, Jeff Bezos, Mark Zuckerberg, John D. Rockefeller, Oprah Winfrey, Warren Buffet, Jacqueline Kennedy Onassis, Thomas Edison, Donald Trump, several heirs and heiresses (including monarchs and royal and aristocratic heirs), and many of the wealthiest of earlier eras – plus the predictable slew of wealthy celebrities. Adding close trines and sextiles, we find Steve Jobs, Cecil Rhodes, Julio Gallo, Grace Kelly, Eva Peron, more notable royals and other heirs to wealth, and, especially, more celebrities, often of considerable celebration and dazzle.
Why is this aspect consistent with wealth? In addition to expressing commonly as an afflicted Venus, the combination also shows an auspiciously aspected Saturn. While Jupiter-Saturn aspects act in part as an affliction to Jupiter (a financial planet), Venus has nothing to do with money per se. Venus-Saturn favorably aspects Saturn without afflicting a money-themed planet.
In many cases, practical considerations are consistent with the more common interpretations of Venus-Saturn: In many cases, success and wealth come at a high personal cost, though this is not inevitable. Also, once wealth is attained, Venus-Saturn has a prudence – one might say, a spirit of sacrifice – that is likely to retain it.
Jupiter-Pluto Aspects
A smaller, yet highly distinctive, list of the wealthy has a close Jupiter-Pluto aspect. Appendix B includes successful entrepreneurs and many who inherited significant wealth, among other wealthy examples with Jupiter aspecting Pluto.
More broadly, Jupiter-Pluto inclines to wealth or prosperity outside the statistically likely range, which observably includes great wealth, great loss, and strong gain-and-lose rhythms.
One problem of over-reliance on this aspect is that it involves two slow planets and persists for weeks and months at a time. Obviously, most people born during those weeks or months do not become uber-wealthy. The faster Venus-Saturn aspects are more practical markers. Nonetheless, Jupiter-Pluto aspects are a strong signal of unusual wealth conditions. (Mundane aspects come and go much more quickly.)
Where Does Money Come From?
In Primer of Sidereal Astrology, Cyril Fagan and Brig. Firebrace rightly observed that Jupiter’s aspects at birth often suggest how one gets money in the first place and what one then does with it. These are not firm rules: Like all aspect behavior, Jupiter aspects find diverse expression, though consistent with the planets’ symbolic themes. Nonetheless, the following are useful guides that you can explore and expand further. Consulting primarily the eminent examples my Example Chart Catalogue (somewhat heavy on entertainer examples), we find:
Comprehensive assessment of wealth and prosperity issues warrants consideration of the 2nd and 8th Houses if either house is occupied. These houses correspond to complementary themes of attachment and detachment.
Houses show nothing objective about wealth or overall prosperity. However, they seem to reflect how much of someone’s psyche is bound up in these themes and how we portray them in our persistent, defended telling of our lives (our “story”).
Consistent with the ancient theory analogizing the 2nd House to Scorpio, 2H seems themed to Mars as the force of competition, proving oneself in battle including business and the fight for resources. Money is a symbol of power acquired or a “banking” of energy expended. Planets in 2H frequently act as if they conjoin (modify) Mars, including its physical, visceral, and sexual power themes.
This aligns with the root idea of 2H as expressing our surging into the world, away from our early roots and parents’ home, to begin tackling and mastering the outer, public world. 2H also is attachment in the sense of persistent identification with things, rather than only the derived sense of ownership.
House 8, when emphasized, most often tells non-financial tales. So far as it speaks to money ideas, they are detached from our ego, thought of broadly as other people’s wealth, a theme summarized diversely in astrology’s literature, e.g., resources shared with a mate or other partner, inheritance, or managing others’ investments or resources.
Though I have included these houses as factors deserving attention, their importance is narrow. Luminaries or a stellium in either house emphasizes its themes strongly, giving them a larger place in someone’s overall story (the ideas own more of the landscape of one’s psyche). Occasionally we find overt examples, such as J.P. Morgan with Sun on the 2nd cusp; Karl Marx’s well-aspected Moon-Sun conjunction (a solar eclipse) and stellium in 2H, or the fact that Marx and Frederick Engels both had Moon in the 2nd; or Warren Buffet’s 8th House Sun. Most people, though, experience house placements more privately (subjectively) without outward show.
Other planets in the 2nd or 8th House somewhat color the house’s themes in our minds according to the planet natures. Malefics show areas of doubt or struggle, benefics show areas of confidence or comfort, and change promoting planets show shifting or unstable areas.
Additionally, the 5th House is historically associated with speculation. However, do not think of this as financial investment or economic maneuvering: Real property investments are associated with the 4th House and IC. 5th House speculation is a form of gambling, expressing the house’s recreation theme. Nonetheless, strong aspects between a planet in 5H and one in 2H or 8H may show psychological linking of the major themes of the connected houses.
Aspects for Wealth
Two aspects are unusually common in nativities of extremely wealthy people. Obviously, not everyone with these natal aspects becomes uber-wealthy – that would mean (limiting ourselves to Class 1 aspects) that as many as 13% of all people would be superrich. Nonetheless, in collections of charts of the wealthiest people, the frequency of these aspects far exceeds statistical expectation.
The two aspects are Venus-Saturn and, to a lesser extent, Jupiter-Pluto.
Venus-Saturn Aspects
Venus-Saturn is the most common aspect for great wealth. For example, close Venus-Saturn conjunctions, oppositions, and squares (the most distinctive for great wealth, whether earned or inherited) occurred at the births of Bill Gates, Jeff Bezos, Mark Zuckerberg, John D. Rockefeller, Oprah Winfrey, Warren Buffet, Jacqueline Kennedy Onassis, Thomas Edison, Donald Trump, several heirs and heiresses (including monarchs and royal and aristocratic heirs), and many of the wealthiest of earlier eras – plus the predictable slew of wealthy celebrities. Adding close trines and sextiles, we find Steve Jobs, Cecil Rhodes, Julio Gallo, Grace Kelly, Eva Peron, more notable royals and other heirs to wealth, and, especially, more celebrities, often of considerable celebration and dazzle.
Why is this aspect consistent with wealth? In addition to expressing commonly as an afflicted Venus, the combination also shows an auspiciously aspected Saturn. While Jupiter-Saturn aspects act in part as an affliction to Jupiter (a financial planet), Venus has nothing to do with money per se. Venus-Saturn favorably aspects Saturn without afflicting a money-themed planet.
In many cases, practical considerations are consistent with the more common interpretations of Venus-Saturn: In many cases, success and wealth come at a high personal cost, though this is not inevitable. Also, once wealth is attained, Venus-Saturn has a prudence – one might say, a spirit of sacrifice – that is likely to retain it.
Jupiter-Pluto Aspects
A smaller, yet highly distinctive, list of the wealthy has a close Jupiter-Pluto aspect. Appendix B includes successful entrepreneurs and many who inherited significant wealth, among other wealthy examples with Jupiter aspecting Pluto.
More broadly, Jupiter-Pluto inclines to wealth or prosperity outside the statistically likely range, which observably includes great wealth, great loss, and strong gain-and-lose rhythms.
One problem of over-reliance on this aspect is that it involves two slow planets and persists for weeks and months at a time. Obviously, most people born during those weeks or months do not become uber-wealthy. The faster Venus-Saturn aspects are more practical markers. Nonetheless, Jupiter-Pluto aspects are a strong signal of unusual wealth conditions. (Mundane aspects come and go much more quickly.)
Where Does Money Come From?
In Primer of Sidereal Astrology, Cyril Fagan and Brig. Firebrace rightly observed that Jupiter’s aspects at birth often suggest how one gets money in the first place and what one then does with it. These are not firm rules: Like all aspect behavior, Jupiter aspects find diverse expression, though consistent with the planets’ symbolic themes. Nonetheless, the following are useful guides that you can explore and expand further. Consulting primarily the eminent examples my Example Chart Catalogue (somewhat heavy on entertainer examples), we find:
- Moon-Jupiter: Wealth especially from entertainment or celebrity, patronage (connections), or family (inheritance).
- Sun-Jupiter: A mix of luck and being very good at what they do. Creating (innovating) something that succeeds. Most end up far better off financially than they started (though many inherited).
- Mercury-Jupiter: Success from doing something very well (plus luck). Always looking for the next opportunity or lucky break. More writers and academics than other aspect groups, but not most examples (the range is far wider).
- Venus-Jupiter: Leveraging connections and popularity, especially in food, hosting, and hospitality. Success seems easy due to a talent or other gift that opens doors. Nonetheless, they invest a surprising amount of hard work just to get good at something. (Many heirs to wealth as well.)
- Mars-Jupiter: Places little emphasis on accumulating (retaining) wealth (never earns it or does not keep it). Wealthy examples usually acquire it from competition or combat requiring strong ambition pursued with dedication.
- Jupiter-Saturn: Success through patient industry (work for it and earn it). May create a product and sell it well (for entertainers, the product is themselves). Sensible with finances. Traditionally thought profitable through real estate.
- Jupiter-Uranus: Success through unlikely paths and surprising luck. Innovation, leading the pack on forward leaning ideas (including technology). Not as much great wealth (except celebrities, of course, and Warren Buffet).
- Jupiter-Neptune: Famous wealth (Getty, Morgan, Rhodes, Hefner) or breakout success in film and entertainment (including wine and sex). Royal and celebrity inheritance. However, impractical relationship to money (easily fooled, drawn to “too good to be true” or dreams independent of feasibility, indulgence).
- Jupiter-Pluto: A mix of those who had wealth handed to them and those that worked for it (including many inheritance examples). May signal outlier acquired wealth, though prosperity may fluctuate widely (it may long endure; others have success collapse once attained.)
Comprehensive assessment of wealth and prosperity issues warrants consideration of the 2nd and 8th Houses if either house is occupied. These houses correspond to complementary themes of attachment and detachment.
Houses show nothing objective about wealth or overall prosperity. However, they seem to reflect how much of someone’s psyche is bound up in these themes and how we portray them in our persistent, defended telling of our lives (our “story”).
Consistent with the ancient theory analogizing the 2nd House to Scorpio, 2H seems themed to Mars as the force of competition, proving oneself in battle including business and the fight for resources. Money is a symbol of power acquired or a “banking” of energy expended. Planets in 2H frequently act as if they conjoin (modify) Mars, including its physical, visceral, and sexual power themes.
This aligns with the root idea of 2H as expressing our surging into the world, away from our early roots and parents’ home, to begin tackling and mastering the outer, public world. 2H also is attachment in the sense of persistent identification with things, rather than only the derived sense of ownership.
House 8, when emphasized, most often tells non-financial tales. So far as it speaks to money ideas, they are detached from our ego, thought of broadly as other people’s wealth, a theme summarized diversely in astrology’s literature, e.g., resources shared with a mate or other partner, inheritance, or managing others’ investments or resources.
Though I have included these houses as factors deserving attention, their importance is narrow. Luminaries or a stellium in either house emphasizes its themes strongly, giving them a larger place in someone’s overall story (the ideas own more of the landscape of one’s psyche). Occasionally we find overt examples, such as J.P. Morgan with Sun on the 2nd cusp; Karl Marx’s well-aspected Moon-Sun conjunction (a solar eclipse) and stellium in 2H, or the fact that Marx and Frederick Engels both had Moon in the 2nd; or Warren Buffet’s 8th House Sun. Most people, though, experience house placements more privately (subjectively) without outward show.
Other planets in the 2nd or 8th House somewhat color the house’s themes in our minds according to the planet natures. Malefics show areas of doubt or struggle, benefics show areas of confidence or comfort, and change promoting planets show shifting or unstable areas.
Additionally, the 5th House is historically associated with speculation. However, do not think of this as financial investment or economic maneuvering: Real property investments are associated with the 4th House and IC. 5th House speculation is a form of gambling, expressing the house’s recreation theme. Nonetheless, strong aspects between a planet in 5H and one in 2H or 8H may show psychological linking of the major themes of the connected houses.
Jim Eshelman
www.jeshelman.com
www.jeshelman.com
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Jim Eshelman
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Checklist
[added 5/10/2023]
Within the larger context of the entire horoscope and (especially luminary signs) and the economic state of one’s formative environment, these points most strongly speak to questions regarding wealth and prosperity:
Within the larger context of the entire horoscope and (especially luminary signs) and the economic state of one’s formative environment, these points most strongly speak to questions regarding wealth and prosperity:
- Jupiter (luck), Saturn (persistence, prudence), and Mars (competition) are primary indicators of money matters.
- Jupiter and Saturn’s balance addresses this directly: Jupiter favors getting (opportunity, entitlement, spending). Saturn favors keeping (earning, producing, saving). Jupiter vs. Saturn is luck vs. labor.
- Mars equates money with competition and power. Angular or in strong luminary aspect: competitive success, often with significant income even absent Jupiter or Saturn. Mars’ cosmic state shows desire and prospects for power and competition.
- Jupiter’s aspects suggest sources of income or wealth.
- Mercury strong (especially angular or conjunct Sun): Business knack, a natural for commerce, handles business part of any career well.
- Venus-Saturn and Jupiter-Pluto aspects: unusually common for extreme wealth.
- 2nd and 8th Houses have narrow importance. If occupied, they reflect how much of the psyche is invested in own vs. relinquish themes and how one regards these.
Jim Eshelman
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Re: Specialized Inquiries: Wealth & prosperity
I've rewritten all the foregoing and added the Checklist. This, I think, is a better current platform from which to work and investigate further.
Jim Eshelman
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Where Does the Money Go?
Loss of great wealth accumulated seems more connected to Mercury and Mars than to Jupiter and Saturn, apparently because the primary consideration is effective (or ineffective) management.
A recent feature article listed two and a half dozen entertainment celebrities who, having gained great wealth, lost most or all of it. For 19 of these celebrities, the day, month, and year of birth were available, plus birth times for all but three. Although 19 charts is too small a number to be statistically significant, these charts make a worthwhile case study, especially valuable because the examples were not picked by an astrologer or with astrology in mind.
For most of these celebrities, mismanagement was behind their massive losses – either personal mismanagement of funds (often simple imprudent spending) or mismanagement by dishonest or incompetent money handlers. In several cases, losses were intertwined with drug or alcohol addiction.
Even with so small a number of cases, minor patterns emerged based on luminary signs and stronger patterns from close aspects. Sun and Moon constellations gave only general indications, though: The most common luminary signs were a mix of constellations showing love of comfort on one hand (Taurus and Sagittarius) and deep involvement with economic themes on the other (Capricorn and Aries). The only sign with no Sun or Moon occupancy was Aquarius, known since ancient times for being the constellation least concerned with money matters.
Aspects were much more interesting and provided the strongest patterns. Most significant aspects involved Mercury or Mars.
Mercury-Pluto leads the others: Eight of the 19 charts (nearly half) had a Class 1 Mercury-Pluto aspect. These eight celebrities all experienced deep financial problems because of financial mismanagement – either their own or that of a business manager – in some cases becoming destitute. Nearly all cases included great debt beyond their means to pay, often including failure to pay income tax. Most sought the protection of bankruptcy.
Why would a Mercury-Pluto life turn out this way? Besides the recognizable pattern of living life with abrupt disruption and redirection, Mercury-Pluto does not normally follow conventional thinking, which, in financial matters, can leave one hanging out on a limb. Often Mercury-Pluto folks are dismissive of both social protocols and the law. While most Mercury-Pluto people are investigative, one subset finds itself investigated by others, including criminal investigators as shown by extreme examples Bernie Madoff, Martin Frankel, Helen Duncan, Ghislaine Maxwell, and Lucky Luciano, many of whom were convicted of fraud.
After Mercury-Pluto, six aspects tie for second place: Mercury-Mars, Venus-Mars, Venus-Neptune, Mars-Jupiter, Mars-Neptune, and Saturn-Neptune. None of these is surprising. I suggest you read the standard interpretations of these six aspects with an eye to how their usual behaviors would impact money management.
All Mercury-Mars examples, by the way, were known drug and alcohol abusers. Also, the aspect can impede careful, patient reasoning and good choices. All others except Saturn-Neptune are known for indulgence, imprudence, and extravagance, forming a reasonable list of aspects for people at any income level who do not always live within their means. Saturn-Neptune can be indifferent to material security.
In the third tier, we encounter a different sort of aspect, including several known for business success and a quality lifestyle, though without expectation of prudence or conscientious care. This makes sense: Everyone in our sample had reached a level of unusual comfort and prosperity before losing it. This third tier of aspects – Moon-Venus, Moon-Jupiter, Mercury-Jupiter, Mercury-Uranus, Mercury-Neptune, Mars-Uranus, Mars-Pluto and Jupiter-Pluto – is a good list of aspects suggesting a comfortable life, some recklessness or impulsiveness, and perhaps too little attention to practical affairs. Jupiter-Pluto is known for sharp (high or low) fluctuations in prosperity.
Mercury-Jupiter, though usually a positive business aspect, can rely overly much on luck (always looking for the next lucky break). All the Mercury-Jupiter examples' money problems were from imprudence and inattentiveness that left them vulnerable to others' dishonesty. I have seen this Mercury-Jupiter pattern on occasion in personal cases as well, for people at all levels of wealth.
As you probably already understand, the presence of these aspects does not mean that a person will have great financial problems. However, they do describe character patterns that make sense for financial problems from these causes.
At the other extreme – those aspects that are rare or absent in the list – the absence of Venus-Jupiter aspects is noteworthy, as well as the near-absence of Sun-Uranus, Moon-Uranus, and Jupiter-Uranus aspects, which (like Uranus-ruled Aquarius) do not have typical relationships to money. Sun-Saturn aspects are also nearly absent, an aspect known for more conscientious caretaking of their resources.
A recent feature article listed two and a half dozen entertainment celebrities who, having gained great wealth, lost most or all of it. For 19 of these celebrities, the day, month, and year of birth were available, plus birth times for all but three. Although 19 charts is too small a number to be statistically significant, these charts make a worthwhile case study, especially valuable because the examples were not picked by an astrologer or with astrology in mind.
For most of these celebrities, mismanagement was behind their massive losses – either personal mismanagement of funds (often simple imprudent spending) or mismanagement by dishonest or incompetent money handlers. In several cases, losses were intertwined with drug or alcohol addiction.
Even with so small a number of cases, minor patterns emerged based on luminary signs and stronger patterns from close aspects. Sun and Moon constellations gave only general indications, though: The most common luminary signs were a mix of constellations showing love of comfort on one hand (Taurus and Sagittarius) and deep involvement with economic themes on the other (Capricorn and Aries). The only sign with no Sun or Moon occupancy was Aquarius, known since ancient times for being the constellation least concerned with money matters.
Aspects were much more interesting and provided the strongest patterns. Most significant aspects involved Mercury or Mars.
Mercury-Pluto leads the others: Eight of the 19 charts (nearly half) had a Class 1 Mercury-Pluto aspect. These eight celebrities all experienced deep financial problems because of financial mismanagement – either their own or that of a business manager – in some cases becoming destitute. Nearly all cases included great debt beyond their means to pay, often including failure to pay income tax. Most sought the protection of bankruptcy.
Why would a Mercury-Pluto life turn out this way? Besides the recognizable pattern of living life with abrupt disruption and redirection, Mercury-Pluto does not normally follow conventional thinking, which, in financial matters, can leave one hanging out on a limb. Often Mercury-Pluto folks are dismissive of both social protocols and the law. While most Mercury-Pluto people are investigative, one subset finds itself investigated by others, including criminal investigators as shown by extreme examples Bernie Madoff, Martin Frankel, Helen Duncan, Ghislaine Maxwell, and Lucky Luciano, many of whom were convicted of fraud.
After Mercury-Pluto, six aspects tie for second place: Mercury-Mars, Venus-Mars, Venus-Neptune, Mars-Jupiter, Mars-Neptune, and Saturn-Neptune. None of these is surprising. I suggest you read the standard interpretations of these six aspects with an eye to how their usual behaviors would impact money management.
All Mercury-Mars examples, by the way, were known drug and alcohol abusers. Also, the aspect can impede careful, patient reasoning and good choices. All others except Saturn-Neptune are known for indulgence, imprudence, and extravagance, forming a reasonable list of aspects for people at any income level who do not always live within their means. Saturn-Neptune can be indifferent to material security.
In the third tier, we encounter a different sort of aspect, including several known for business success and a quality lifestyle, though without expectation of prudence or conscientious care. This makes sense: Everyone in our sample had reached a level of unusual comfort and prosperity before losing it. This third tier of aspects – Moon-Venus, Moon-Jupiter, Mercury-Jupiter, Mercury-Uranus, Mercury-Neptune, Mars-Uranus, Mars-Pluto and Jupiter-Pluto – is a good list of aspects suggesting a comfortable life, some recklessness or impulsiveness, and perhaps too little attention to practical affairs. Jupiter-Pluto is known for sharp (high or low) fluctuations in prosperity.
Mercury-Jupiter, though usually a positive business aspect, can rely overly much on luck (always looking for the next lucky break). All the Mercury-Jupiter examples' money problems were from imprudence and inattentiveness that left them vulnerable to others' dishonesty. I have seen this Mercury-Jupiter pattern on occasion in personal cases as well, for people at all levels of wealth.
As you probably already understand, the presence of these aspects does not mean that a person will have great financial problems. However, they do describe character patterns that make sense for financial problems from these causes.
At the other extreme – those aspects that are rare or absent in the list – the absence of Venus-Jupiter aspects is noteworthy, as well as the near-absence of Sun-Uranus, Moon-Uranus, and Jupiter-Uranus aspects, which (like Uranus-ruled Aquarius) do not have typical relationships to money. Sun-Saturn aspects are also nearly absent, an aspect known for more conscientious caretaking of their resources.
Jim Eshelman
www.jeshelman.com
www.jeshelman.com