Moon in Pisces sign project

[Jim Eshelman]

Welcome to the Moon in Pisces discussions project, which will run March 15 - April 13, 2018 (and then will remain around in case people want to revisit it in the future). Please gather your list of Moon in Pisces people (especially those you know personally) and join us. (This includes a majority of the people on this forum.)

Here are Moon in Pisces interpretive resources on the forum:
Primary section: viewtopic.php?f=13&t=34#p153
Cyril Fagan: viewtopic.php?f=13&t=105&p=636#p650
Garth Allen: viewtopic.php?f=13&t=33#p141
Manilius: viewtopic.php?f=13&t=121#p749

My current concise summary of Moon in Pisces (always subject to change) reads:

Most truly themselves when being someone else. Dramatizes a personal fiction; "big fish" confidence (self-important, airs?). Love having a "secret side." Divas. Emotionally driven (haunted). Fascinated with the unknown. Religious thinking style. Faith, commitment to beliefs or vision. Judgmental. Hardened personal reality (stuck patterns).

[Jupiter Sets at Dawn]

I'm soooo confuuused!

Also, I really like maps. I used USGS maps instead of art till I finally found some art (all of two pieces...) worth hanging. But if I have nothing else to read, I'm happy playing around on google maps.

And I have always been accused of swimming like a fish, which I guess is true. I have and love a kayak - ONE PERSON kayak, thank you. Not much makes me sadder than those damn razor mussels that have destroyed most of the lakes.

I don't, and never have, enjoyed fishing. I'll read up in the bow, thanks. Don't hit me with that hook. I don't eat fish much. Tastes too much like fish.

[James Condor]

I enjoy looking at maps too JSAP. Google maps, google Earth and any map really. I read maps for fun sometimes. I am especially drawn to eastern thought and also psychology and philosophy. I enjoy driving, cycling, walking, hiking. I love the outdoors. Nature. Animals. I talk to animals. I make animal sounds.
Im a natural musician. Played all the instruments well in elementary school music class and got As on written tests. The teachers got me to join band. I had a hard time being social and quit. I was nervous/anxious and too judgemental of my peers. I am an introvert mostly. I suppose I would rather be lazy and easy, comfortable . I would go back in time and and commit! Now I just play guitar and keyboards.
I am not a good swimmer. I sink! I love taking baths though.
I am very intuitive as opposed to sensing. But, I am quite the equal combo of thinking and feeling.

[Jupiter Sets at Dawn]

I love exploring. If a truck rolls on the interstate and the road is closed, I can get home any of five different ways, cause I get bored going the same way more than a couple of times, so I already tried all the other options. Round the back of the restaurant, through the alley, into the parking lot and out the other side and I cut two blocks and a major intersection out.

I played several instruments, and was considered concert quality in three. Then a Sagittarius decided he was in charge of my "career," I got a broken wrist and was pressured to "practice" even though the doctor said I shouldn't. It didn't heal right and I stopped playing when anyone else could hear, and stopped entirely for several decades. Picked up a keyboard at a garage sale last fall, but I'm going to sell it when my neighbor holds her garage sale later this spring.

I prefer to swim underwater. James you should try a snorkel.

[James Condor]

Ah, yes routes. Alleys, parking lots, I cut through them often. Cycling and walking really allow me to see different nooks and cranies. I haven't swam in a long time. I did swim underwater often. I really enjoyed swimming to the depths to grab items.

[James Condor]

A Pisces moon friend of 20 years or so, Libra sun, mars in Sagittarius, was addicted to gambling. He might be still but we aren't in contact anymore for he moved to outside Milwaukee. He never did drugs though. He drank every so often but not hard. He is a good long distance runner. He too was an awful swimmer, worse than me. He doggy paddled. He never learned how. He was sorta quiet, introvert but social. Sensitive. Took things personal. Subjective. Didn't like being called out, nagged, judged, though he whined or took offense when others did it to him. He could dish it but not take it. He was different around other people. Then again, who isn't. Travels often for marathons

[James Condor]

I haven't been able to see the connection of my Pisces moon and the forum summaries-
Fictitious,
Pretending to be another
Relishing secret side

I had a Pisces moon friend of over 15 years move away a couple years ago-
Gambled allot.
Mimic others or quote others but not "pretending to be another"
He did seem off when meeting new people/being around new people, didn't seem like himself. But he didn't make up a fictitious side
Exaggeration yes

[Jim Eshelman]

A discussion in a Sun in Pisces thread that probably also has implications for Moon in Pisces begins here: https://solunars.com/viewtopic.php?f=14 ... 190#p44183

[Jim Eshelman]

In rereading this today, I got very caught up in the maps/navigation discussion. It seems, by consensus, that this is a thing for Pisces Moons. What's curious to me is that I always thought it was a Virgo thing - I could have said about me most of what JSAD said about her. Virgo Sun in the sense of coordinates and instinctive awareness of how data points fit together and all the military leaders have a mastery of topography and relationships and routings.

So, I now wonder if this is one of those axis-polarity things: Virgo and Pisces both into maps but perhaps from different angles. The military strategists I mentioned under Virgo compared to the marine navigators who were the core of exploring the oceans and mapping the New World, etc.

[Jim Eshelman]

I just reviewed the Moon in Pisces actors who won Best Actor or Best Actress Oscars - comparing their movies. For their most honored rolls, there were a several (more than we usually get) where the movie reflected their Moon sign. Here are the ones that jump out at me:

Charles Laughton, The Private Life of Henry VIII. King Henry VIII had a Pisces Moon.
Marlon Brando, On the Waterfront and The Godfather. Do I need to explain either?
Rex Harrison, My Fair Lady. The Pygmalion story fits Neptune + exaltation of Venus.
Kathy Bates, Misery. I think this fits the negative psyche, plus the movie seems Piscian to me.
Helen Hunt, As Good As It Gets. What an upbeat Piscian phrase!
Kevin Spacey, American Beauty. Seems fitting for the exaltation of Venus (plus Pisces really fits the movie).

Movies where Moon in Pisces actors won with no connection to Pisces obvious to me (without stretching it): Patricia Neal (Hud), Ellen Burstyn (Alice Doesn't Live Here Anymore), John Voight (Coming Home), Sally Field (Norma Rae, Places in the Heart), William Hurt (Kiss of the Spider Woman), Jeremy Irons (Reversal of Fortune), Holly Hunter (The Piano),

Potentially (stretching it?) I could say Hud is about a nasty rascal, Coming Home [not a travel movie!] is about romance amidst paralyzing disability, Places in the Heart fits by title but not at all by story, Kiss of the Spider Woman is about prison inmates and fake movies. and The Piano had, well, some amazing scenes involving water.

[Jim Eshelman]

Moon in Pisces people from my large Example Chart Catalogue:

• King Henry VIII, Pres. Charles De Gaulle, Cardinal Richelieu, Lorenzo de Medici, Rep. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, Thomas More, Heinrich Himmler, Edith Wilson, Justice Stephen Breyer
• Marlon Brando, Dennis Hopper, Alan Alda, Joe Pesci, Antonio Banderas, John Cleese, John Holmes, Divine, Elvira, Nina Hartley, Sarah Bernhardt, Jean Harlow, Kay Francis, Rosalind Russell, Gena Rowlands, Annette Funicello, Lily Tomlin, Ellen Burstyn, Paula Prentiss, Kathy Bates, Catherine Zeta-Jones, Helen Hunt, Lynn Redgrave, Lisa Edelstein, Lucy Lawless, Ellen DeGeneris, Dana Delany, Tyra Banks, Jerry Garcia, will.I.am, Connie Francis, Whitney Houston, Patti Smith, Kesha Sebert, Duffy, Luciano Pavarotti, Anna Moffo
• Algernon Swinburne, Anatole France, Anton Chekhov, Hermann Hesse, Tamora Pierce, Immanuel Kant
• Salvador Dali, Marjorie Cameron, Carole Feuerman
• Joan of Arc, Martin Luther, Mother Meera
• Heidi Fleiss, Simone de Beauvoir, Oriana Fallaci, Peggy Fleming, Rodney King
• Bill Gates, Steve Jobs, Ada Lovelace, John Forbes Nash Jr., Johannes Trithemius, John Flamsteed, Lucy Hutchinson, Wilhelm Gesenius
• Jeffrey Dahmer, Rev. Jim Jones, O.J. Simpson
• Israel Regardie, Jack Parsons, Paul Foster Case, Johann Muller (Regiomontanus), Alan Leo

The number of religious figures (often gigantic) are noteworthy including many who battled for it. Some are listed together and some in other parts of the list: In terms of the Reformation, it includes both Martin Luther and Henry VIII, but also Thomas More; it includes Joan of Arc and (if the data were historical to fit the higher data quality requirements) the most likely birth date of Jesus. Even Rev. Jim Jones stands out.

There are also startlingly many who are connected with computers - the exact process of creating and empowering computers - including not only Gates and Jobs but the likes of Ada Lovelace and John Forbes Nash, plus (to join the coders) decoders like Trithemius, Lucy Hutchinson, and Gesenius. The groupings are quite informative including the entertainers (who have more than a few that rely heavily on masks, makeup, and costuming).

[Jim Eshelman]

I've finished the Pisces Mion rewrite. The full page i here:
viewtopic.php?f=13&t=34#p153

The summary has changed a lot. Captured by the three words Imagination, Actor, Explorer it now reads:

Distinctive characters, actors in a personal legend, oriented and secure within its familiarity. Satiates senses, excites imagination, fascinated with the unknown and enchanting (explorers), relishes having a secret side. Seeks storybook relationships. Faith (spiritual), optimism, inspiring, motivating, yet haunted. Aesthetic, drawn to the fanciful. Music, artistic. Eros vs. morality.

This one was difficult for me - hit my blind spots. Pisces Moon is a natural blind spot for a Virgo-Aquarius. I found I could barely conceive what these people are like and had to work harder than usual to plant myself within their point of view and witness their process. Even though I know several quite well (including several of you), to a great extent I find little expressed similarity across the group. This was part of what led me to the perspective that they are all (like) actors in a film, their immediate role mattering more than the idea that they are a particular such-and-so outside of the role. I thought Neptune's transit of my Moon right now would make this easier and, perhaps to some extent, it did. Still, on reading the final list of characteristics, I find them to be floating amorphic details not anchored by any kind of center. I think the principles I stated at the beginning are the fountain from which everything else springs and I still see the great difference between different Pisces Moons, only partly clarified by their Sun-signs; the list of people still lands for me like a crowd of anonymous extras and day-players on a movie set, rather than as an army surging with broad commonalties.

That's a long way of saying: If you have any afterthoughts after seeing this, please let me know. I'm closing the books and considering this one done unless it has a dramatic new insight that makes it all snap together better.

[James Condor]

Pisces moon-
My understanding- (needs cross references)

Good at forecasting. Good at predicting
Highly intuitive
Connects the dots
Senses red flags ( but often ignores them)
Bold (but as a symptom?)
Curious, to the point of harm (navigation, gets into vague situations, gets lost in thought)
Sensitive (desires an ultimate connection)
Gathers information easily (quantity, too much info!, information overload)
Indirect communication (won’t answer you specifically, wants mystery, reads between the lines, indecisive)
Loyal and trusting until betrayed(On a mission)
Easily mislead (believes in good)
Easily used by others (manipulated)
Empath
Doesn’t like pressure (wants to make own choice when needed)
Don’t get them wrong (will return the favor, will get mad!)
Can’t be pinned down! (Fishy, mind travel, multi dimensional)
Hidden (disappearing from present moment, lost in thought)
OCD? .(same thing over and over)
Seeks stimulation(addictive personality)
Very misunderstood? (High IQ)
Ostracized

[RingsOfSaturn22]

Ok, I know I'm late to the party, but since James chimed in, I thought I would too. James gave a good overall summary, so I will use that as a starting point for the conversation.

First, I want to address something Jim wrote:

Most truly themselves when being someone else.

This was part of what led me to the perspective that they are all (like) actors in a film, their immediate role mattering more than the idea that they are a particular such-and-so outside of the role.

When I first read these, I almost took offense because it almost sounded like you were saying that we were phonies! So perhaps I can offer some insight.

I would describe myself as being a chameleon. I can alter or change myself in order to fit in whatever environment I find myself in. But in altering myself, I'm not "being someone else" — rather, it's quite the contrary! My personality has so many facets and dimensions available that I can choose to highlight just one at any particular moment, depending on what is needed at the moment. To someone external, it may come across as "being someone else", but it's all me!!! All of the facets are me — I'm not acting. Most people are just used to associating with one dominant aspect of their personality while the other sides rarely see the light of day unless provoked in particular situations. (This is part of what I need to talk about in Jim's sun meditation thread — the descriptions in that thread are hard for me to digest!)

Now, with that said, I DO enjoy acting. But the acting is still birthed out of things that are within me. I can connect myself with most things because at some level, I share something in common with them. As a result, it becomes easy to understand the point of view of another. Usually when I'm "acting", it is out of boredom and in a joking way — I love practical jokes.

Emotionally driven (haunted).

I don't know what this means. But I will say I perceive things in a very vivid, intense way. That includes sights, sounds, tastes, textures, and emotions. Based on conversations with others, it seems I experience all of the above MUCH more profoundly than others do. And thus, when I'm trying to communicate this intensity to others, it gets perceived as being "overly dramatic". But I don't think I would call myself emotionally driven. I'm usually very calm and even tempered,

Fascinated with the unknown.

100%. I feel comfortable in the realms of secret or hidden things. I love mysteries (investigating mysteries).

************************************************************

For the list that James wrote, if a point applies to me, I will put it in bold and/or add commentary:

• Good at forecasting. Good at predicting
  Yes. Sometimes, I wish I wasn't right, though
  _
• Highly intuitive
  Yes. And it gets stronger and more refined with every year that goes by, even though I doubted it at first.
  _
• Connects the dots
  Yes. It's natural for me to see the big picture, or at least a much bigger picture than the average person. Trying to describe that bigger picture to others can sometimes be like words falling on deaf ears.
  _
• Senses red flags ( but often ignores them)
  Yes. Often. But I wouldn't say I ignore them. Rather, I second guess myself sometimes and try to convince myself that maybe I was wrong and just reading into things too much. But I usually end up being right, unfortunately.
  _
• Bold (but as a symptom?)
  I don't think I would describe myself as bold. I'm usually very reserved and cautious, despite having partile Mars on the 10th cusp! Others view me as being a risk taker, but maybe they don't realize I always calculate my odds of success before taking action. So, that to me is not really a "risk". If I see large groups of people being taken advantage of, I will fight and defend them (still in a calculated way, though). I feel it is my duty to stand up for justice.
  _
• Curious, to the point of harm (navigation, gets into vague situations, gets lost in thought)
  Curious? 110% But not to the point of getting myself in trouble. Even when exploring something unknown, I instinctively know how far is "too far", and usually respect that limit. I do get lost in thought (in a positive way) and in dream too.
  _
• Sensitive (desires an ultimate connection)
  See what I wrote to Jim above about perceiving a LOT. I desire an ultimate connection not with anyone in particular, but with ALL things and God.
  _
• Gathers information easily (quantity, too much info!, information overload)
  Yes. Apparently this seems hard for others? Maybe this is more of my Virgo sun coming through?
  _
• Indirect communication (won’t answer you specifically, wants mystery, reads between the lines, indecisive)
  I feel this one needs some qualification. I do use indirect communication sometimes, but not for the reason you stated. I do it mainly to keep harmony and to not offend. (I'm told my words can cut like a knife.) Or sometimes because I don't know if I can trust you, so I'm "reading" you and feeling you out. Others times, I do it because I haven't made up my mind yet about where I stand on a certain topic.
  _
• Loyal and trusting until betrayed(On a mission)
  Yes. I'm the most loyal friend one could ever have. But if you betray that loyalty — let's just say you better say your prayers
  _
• Easily mislead (believes in good)
  This was true for me as a child because I could always see the potential of what someone COULD become, even if they weren't living up to it at that particular moment. I believed in the vision of what I knew was possible — the fuller version of reality. I had to learn, over time, how to distinguish what someone was in their fuller form, and who they are actually being currently in this reality.
  _
• Easily used by others (manipulated)
  True as a child. See above point.
  _
• Empath
  Yes. I especially had problems with this as a child because I didn't know the difference between my own emotions and the emotions of others. It all felt unified and continuous to me. I had to learn to differentiate.
  _
• Doesn’t like pressure (wants to make own choice when needed)
  Yes. I need my autonomy. And I don't like high pressure situations.
  _
• Don’t get them wrong (will return the favor, will get mad!)
  Not sure how to interpret this one
  _
• Can’t be pinned down! (Fishy, mind travel, multi dimensional)
  Yes. I have lots of interests. As soon as someone thinks they've figured me out, it's like they get hit with a curve ball and are left scratching their heads. It's not something I do intentionally — it's just the way it is. I get an image of a labyrinth inside of me. People try to figure out the labyrinth, but just end up getting lost. I warn people don't try to figure me out because you will give yourself a headache trying to do so. It's entertaining watching a curious soul try, though.
  _
• Hidden (disappearing from present moment, lost in thought)
  This is a curious one because a friend once said to me I'm the kind of person that comes into one's life and has a dramatic impact, and then I disappear and you are left wondering if I even existed in the first place — that perhaps, they just imagined my existence.
  _
• OCD? .(same thing over and over)
  Sometimes. I can get hyperfocused on something if I'm in the midst of unraveling a mystery.
  _
• Seeks stimulation(addictive personality)
  I don't tend towards addictions, but I naturally am very stimulated from my environment and thoughts. There is SOOO much activity in the environment around us. You don't really need a lot of extra stimulation beyond that. So I have no real attraction to drugs, alcohol, gambling, or other such addictions.
  _
• Very misunderstood? (High IQ)
  Yes. I had to accept that I will be misunderstood by the overwhelming majority of people. I'm ok with that. So I just usually smile and keep my mouth shut most of the time.
  _
• Ostracized
  Yes. Tied in with the misunderstood thing.

Although this wasn't explicitly mentioned, spirituality and a sense of connection with all things is very important. Also imagination and creativity. Other realms are a fascination. (I'd almost include the mind as its own realm, so thus, an interest in psychology and astrology.) I like drawing and calligraphy. Foreign languages. I could care less about fame and notoriety.

If it helps, in the Myers-Briggs personality type, I seem to fit most with an INFJ. Personality Junkie's description of INFJ I feel is quite good. There is a lot of overlap with Moon in Pisces.

I am not a good swimmer. I sink! I love taking baths though.

Same!!! I can't swim at all. I can't even float! But I like being in the water. I love getting into the ocean — but I know my limits!

Im a natural musician. Played all the instruments well in elementary school music class and got As on written tests. The teachers got me to join band. I had a hard time being social and quit. I was nervous/anxious and too judgemental of my peers. I am an introvert mostly. I suppose I would rather be lazy and easy, comfortable . I would go back in time and and commit! Now I just play guitar and keyboards.

Singer here. I play some piano too. I might get into drums one day.

[SteveS]

Rings wrote:

…the descriptions in that thread are hard for me to digest!)

Me too Rings. Jim has such a natural in-depth knowledge of the Signs, it is difficult for me to understand at times where he is coming from. I have never been a Sign astrologer with my astrological work, but think/feel I understand how they unfold in my life.
Jim Eshelman wrote:

Fascinated with the unknown.

Rings responded:

100%. I feel comfortable in the realms of secret or hidden things. I love mysteries (investigating mysteries).

Me too! I hace read where Neptune and or Scorpio play a role with this, but don't know for sure.
If I ever get through discussing your posts with you Rings , I will get back to attempt to post in Jim’s topic thread here.

[James Condor]

To say “ most truly themselves, when being someone else” maybe implies this
It may imply intent to impose, be fraudulent, to be a con artist, to have a lack of integrity (but this isn’t true!!!)
Pisces may be disreputable in their lack of clear goals, intent, commitment, communication. But even this isn’t true grounds to ostracize.
It may imply Pisces moon mimics in order to learn
It may imply they are open to learn by doing, embodying another in order to truly relate. Like a method actor.
As in absorbing an idea, role, getting lost in it, and leaving behind, our past self.
JE made a great point about Pisces and Temptation
Think about how tempting it is for us to eat the forbidden fruit.
Pisces moon sorta learns the hard ,long, way.

[RingsOfSaturn22]

It may imply Pisces moon mimics in order to learn
It may imply they are open to learn by doing, embodying another in order to truly relate. Like a method actor.
As in absorbing an idea, role, getting lost in it, and leaving behind, our past self.

Yes, yes, and yes! This is 100% true. I feel like you hit the nail on the head right there!

Pisces moon sorta learns the hard ,long, way.

For me, this particular point hasn't been true. It has actually been the exact opposite! For the most part, compared to most people, I haven't had to learn things the hard way. I've avoided most hardships because I've watched OTHER people go through those things, or even just saw the story in a book or a movie, and that was enough for me to "get" that lesson and never make the mistake. So I learned the lesson on the "mental" spheres and never had to endure it in the "physical" realm. (Back to the idea of Pisces and other "worlds".)

I would think this would be a common sense thing to do, but apparently, through observation, for most people this process seems foreign! They seem to have to bang their head around many times (sometimes YEARS) before they "get it". (Although they complain, I SWEAR on some level they enjoy it, otherwise, why keep subjecting yourself to such torture?)

I am an eternal observer, both of self as well as of others. I don't know if that is a Piscean trait or the Virgo kicking in. I will often sit and people watch, just so I can learn what NOT to do!

I haven't seen Jim's post on Pisces and Temptation, but just based on an initial gut reaction, I'd say curiosity would probably be the bigger factor rather than temptation in and of itself. I associate temptation with strongly desiring something, but curiosity is something different to me. That said, if one doesn't have other factors to help keep curiosity in check, I definitely see how it could lead to a LOT of problems with addictions for Pisces people.

[RingsOfSaturn22]

If I ever get through discussing your posts with you Rings , I will get back to attempt to post in Jim’s topic thread here.

Haha, I feel the same.

But it seems that in an odd, indirect way, we ARE actually responding to Jim's questions in that new moon thread! I feel like most of the latest responses in this thread hit at a lot of his questions, and can probably provide a lot of insight.

[Jim Eshelman]

…the descriptions in that thread are hard for me to digest!)

Me too Rings. Jim has such a natural in-depth knowledge of the Signs, it is difficult for me to understand at times where he is coming from. I have never been a Sign astrologer with my astrological work, but think/feel I understand how they unfold in my life.

The goal has been to base them as close to 100% on observation - on statistical results of the Gauquelin character trait data, other inferential statistical research such as vocational projects, and then mostly on personal observation. Then, when the art of a writer allows that the same thing can be said with equal accuracy in several ways, to articulate the information in a way consistent with traditional treatment of the signs.

The theory of Sidereal sign interpretation seems completely clear to me. I can explain it easily but want to emphasize that there is (by now) almost nothing in the interpretations that is derived just from theory. I sweated a lot of years to pin it all down observationally so that Sidereal Astrology has at least as stable an understanding of the minutia of human behavior as Linda Goodman gave Tropical astrologers in her brilliant, never-surpassed Sun Signs.

Anyway, here is the theoretical model that observed facts fit: About 80% of all traits of a sign come from its dignities and debilities. (This does not mean that the dignities and debilities cause these characteristics, but rather that they resemble them closely.)

1. Each sign is LIKE its ruler and exalted planet.
2. Each sign is UNLIKE planets ruling or exalted in the opposite sign (i.e., its own detriment and fall planets).

That's 80% of the answer. With this alone you have what you need to understand the Sidereal signs and comparatively conclude whether the Tropical or Sidereal fits better. \

About 15% comes from the quadruplicity.

Most of the remaining 5% is evident in the archetypal symbolism of the sign.
https://solunars.com/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=7814
This probably amounts to much more than 5% because it usually overlaps the dignities-debilities and quadruplicity in many cases. It is more important to know that dignities, debilities, and quadruplicities amount for 95% of the meaning than to stress over archetypal symbolism having only 5%.

Other factors (primarily triplicities) have trace characteristics: You can discern patterns but one rarely needs them.

[Jim Eshelman]

But it seems that in an odd, indirect way, we ARE actually responding to Jim's questions in that new moon thread! I feel like most of the latest responses in this thread hit at a lot of his questions, and can probably provide a lot of insight.

Do you mean the meditation thread? I don't see that this is so, since that's not about signs at all. Also, the purpose of that thread isn't at all to learn anything new about astrological factors but, rather, to integrate to you, by the practice of the meditations, the core essence of the planets and then see what consequences arise from you doing the meditations. (It's a training routine.)

[RingsOfSaturn22]

But it seems that in an odd, indirect way, we ARE actually responding to Jim's questions in that new moon thread! I feel like most of the latest responses in this thread hit at a lot of his questions, and can probably provide a lot of insight.

Do you mean the meditation thread? I don't see that this is so, since that's not about signs at all. Also, the purpose of that thread isn't at all to learn anything new about astrological factors but, rather, to integrate to you, by the practice of the meditations, the core essence of the planets and then see what consequences arise from you doing the meditations. (It's a training routine.)

Yes, I was referring to the meditation thread.

It was ironic that James came in and started responding to this thread, because it is actually very instrumental in me organizing my thoughts about what I need to say in the meditation threads. The responses here have been the meditation out loud, so to speak.

Regarding the point of "integrating to oneself", I don't feel anything really changes for me in that regard. Rather, it's just helping me to better verbalize what I'm already aware of and giving me new ways of thinking about it. But the type of meditation you described is just a daily way of life for me for years, so that's why it feels like nothing changes. I just don't usually talk about these perceptions with people, hence the difficulty in finding words.