Lee Harvey Oswald's final SSR

[Jim Eshelman]

Where did Lee Harvey Oswald spend his final birthday (October 18, 1963)? This has been difficult to determine but it seems he was already in Irving, Texas near Dallas.

The standard story is that his wife went to Irving, Texas (essentially Dallas) September 23. Lee somehow ended up in Houston where he boarded a bus for Mexico September 26; and that he headed for Mexico City and tried to get a visa into Cuba. Some researchers believe the pictures of Oswald in Mexico were of another man and that Oswald was never there. In a sense it doesn't matter - that Mexico loop being a side-story from the story - because, as Wikipedia phrases it, "on October 18 [his birthday] the Cuban embassy approved the visa, but by this time Oswald was back in the United States..." He'd left Mexico October 2, arriving in Dallas October 3. He got the job at the Texas School Book Depository by October 16. All the reports seem to be that he was a consistent, reliable worker that - by November 22 - people remembered as being on the job regularly.

Except - small difference - according to Wikipedia he stayed at a rooming house near work during the week but spent weekends with his wife at her friends' house in Irving, commuting on Monays and Fridays. His final SSR occurred on October 19l 1963 just after 1:30 AM so he presumably was in Irving. If we want to get picky, the house here they stayed was 32N48'35" 96W58'45".

Something to note in examining whatever SSR we get, his daughter was born October 20, one day after his SSR. (This doesn't show much in the SSR but might be the angular Moon.)

Oswald's final SSR occurred October 19, 1963, 1:34:29 AM CST, at the Paine house in Irving, TX, 32N48'35" 96W58'45".

[Jim Eshelman]

Here is the breakdown if this very busy chart with nine highly malefic foreground planets. It especially captures the essence of the most malefic aspect of the time, the Saturn-Neptune square.

t Mars on IC -8°56'
r Mars on WP-a -1°24'
r Uranus on Z -0°21'
t Saturn on WP -0°17'
------------------------
t Moon on IC +0°52'
t Neptune on IC +1°01'
r Mercury on IC +4°15'
t Venus on IC +7°36'
r Venus on IC +9°29'

t Moon-Neptune co 0°06'
r Mercury-Mars sq 0°32'
r Venus-Mars sq 0°33'
t Saturn sq r Mercury 0°37'
t Moon-Saturn sq 1°43'
t Saturn-Neptune sq 1°48'
t Venus co r Venus 1°52'
t Neptune co r Mercury 2°20'
t Moon co r Mercury 2°25'
t Venus sq r Mars 2°27' M
t Venus-Saturn sq 2°44' M
t Neptune sq r Mars 2°52'
t Moon sq r Mars 2°57'
t Venus co r Mercury 3°21' M
t Mars op r Uranus 3°46'

[Jim Eshelman]

What everybody agrees happened to him in the month or so lived after this birthday: He was arrested, charged with murder, and then killed in cold blood on live national TV.

What is also believed or alleged to have occurred is that he single-handedly killed President Kennedy.

Does the chart show the part everybody agrees on? Yes, it's a terrible chart especially with the Moon interactions with the Saturn-Neptune square, all tightly angular. None of us would like to have this SSR. It shows suffering and things turning quite against him in many ways.

Does this chart show him committing the murder? It definitely could. His two natal foreground aspects are the strategic, military-skilled Mercury-Mars square (aspected by SSR Moon) and the passionate, most common aspect for murderers Venus-Mars. That's aside from the many indications that could be interpreted (one way of viewing them) of mental illness.

Yet nobody has alleged mental illness as a cause of thus shooting. If he is guilty of the crime, it took more skill and clarity than he was believed to have. Some of the "mental illness" aspects are suicidal and there is always a possibility that he sacrificed himself for some reason; but that possibility outright demands a conspiracy, a larger number of players in the story.

Read simply, from the beginning, this chart looks to me far more like the chart of someone who was a victim than a victimizer. The Saturn-Neptune is burying him. Though charts around the murder had Sun with the Saturn-Neptune square, his SSR has Moon with them: He seems to me passive in the face of circumstances. (Part of what makes it look suicidal is the sense of having no means or will to resist enormous suffering.) The exactly angular Moon-Neptune conjunction is only 0°06' wide.

Going by this chart only, he seems more the victim than the victimizer, very much the patsy played for a fool.

In any case, this chart plays up the since of secrecy, scheming, deception. It's hard to filter out whether it is more deception FROM or UPON him, but it looks like his mind and emotions are being befuddled.

So - going only from this SSR and nothing else - my opinion would be that most likely this was the map of another victim of the events of November 22, probably connected to the real perpetrators, part of the strategy or larger plan, and probably capable of doing it himself; but, if we rule out mental illness (which nobody connected to the case has ever alleged), it does not seem to be the chart of someone who did the crime.

[Jim Eshelman]

Dealy Plaza centers on 32N46'43" 96W48'31". The usual coordinates for Dallas are within a minute of arc, so always thought close enough.

Oswald's SLR occurred November 20, two days before the shooting. It's also pretty busy:

r Neptune on MC -7°57'
t Pluto on MC -2°13'
t Mercury on Asc -1°10'
-----------------------------
t Mars on EP-a 0°42'
t Venus on EP-a 0°53'
t Uranus on M +7°30'
t Sun on Asc +8°38'

t Venus-Mars co 0°09' M
t Mercury-Pluto sq 1°03' M
t Sun-Uranus sq 1°09' M

This is a loud, dramatic chart. It's two main aspects, Mercury-Pluto and Venus-Mars, are consistent with crime and violence, although their simple meaning is that the mind is warped, he has to confront stark, naked reality. From this SLR I have no trouble thinking he did the crime. He certainly was not an innocent. However, nothing here contradicts the impressions I had of the SSR except that the SLR shows him more intimately involved.

It is easier to read this as violence perpetrated on him, though - and he was indeed murdered - than to see him as the killer. However, this chart isn't consistent with that, either.

[Jim Eshelman]

A quick look at his transits:

t Pluto oc r Saturn 42'
t Pluto tr r Moon 8'
t Jupiter sq r Asc 0°36'
t Moon co r Mars 0°32'

These aren't very impressive by themselves, certainly not as a lead-in and build-up. Nonetheless, Moon's partile conjunction with his Mars is consistent with him taking a violent action that hour.

Oswald's local EP-a for Dallas (specifically for Dealy Plaza) was 25°41' Taurus. At Kennedy's assassination Mars was in that vicinity. Did it touch the local angle then or when Oswald was murdered two days later, November 24 at 11:21 AM? Yes, it did - for the former.

25°41' Tau - L EP-a
26°41' Sco - t Mars on angle for Kennedy murder
27°44' Sco - t Mars on angle for Oswald murder

Mars (conjunct Venus partile) was on Oswald's local WP-a for the moment of the assassination. Transiting Mars conjoined his local angle as transiting Moon was partile conjunct his Mars. This combination alone tells me that he was indeed involved in the violence of November 22 (more even than the violence of his own murder two days later). Other charts suggest to me that he was in some sense a fall guy, but the amount of violence descending specifically on his chart at the Kennedy shooting - even more than at his own murder! - is inescapable. (Transits for his murder were essentially identical except these two Mars transits had moved on.)

[Jim Eshelman]

Secondary progressions were worthless. No need to pay any more attention to them.

Solar Arcs were much more remarkable:

d Sun oc r Eris -5'
d Eris co r Saturn +5'
d Asc co r Pluto +7'
d Jupiter op r Sun +17'

This is quite dramatic! These aspects clearly put him at a destiny crossroads. Jupiter's direction to his Sun is quite eye=catching: Though it is slightly past exact, there is nothing we know of his life over the prior months that could be touted as a standout victory or elevation of his standing (other than the weak example of his daughter's birth that otherwise seems a negligible event in his life). His one possible "standout victory or elevation of his standing" - his claim to fame - was this shooting.

Note that if his local angles are used, d Asc squares his Saturn 29' rather than conjoining his Pluto 7'.

[Jim Eshelman]

The SNQ is slightly interesting. Oswald had a progressed Sun-Uranus opposition not yet in partile orb but each was within 1° of SNQ meridian. Something highly unusual might have been expected for that day (which it was - no matter how you look at the event).

Over the next two days when he was much in the spotlight, transiting Sun moved across his progressed Moon (1°28' shy of exact at the shooting, but partile beginning half a day later).

Moving the SNQ forward two days, natal Uranus is minutes from MC and progressed Mars minutes from Descendant when he was shot. This is a great chart! It's like progressed Mars square natal Uranus for one day. Transiting Sun was 29' past conjunct progressed Moon.


His SQ for Kennedy's assassination has t Mars 0°46' from SQ Nadir. Transiting Neptune was 0°04' from conjunct his 21°42' Libra progressed Moon. This clearly puts him in the middle of the violence in some role. Over the next two days these contacts both persist so they are active (Mars 0°34' from angle, Neptune 0°04' from progressed Moon) for his own murder.

His PSSR isn't strong. It has no angularities and the Neptune transit to progressed Moon is wider.


Checking his Novienic Lunar Returns, which I'm testing, for Kennedy's murder Oswald's NLR has Saturn 0°28' above Descendant square Neptune 0°34' off Nadir. Natal Mars is 1°00' from WP (natal Mercury-Mars on angles). This reinforces the dual ideas of (1) he was involved in executing strategic, tactical violence and (2) he was a dupe.

For Oswald's own murder by Jack Ru, the chart is entirely different! The NLR from that morning had Sun rising paran Uranus-Pluto on MC (Sun 0°05' from Asc, Uranus 1°53' from MC, Sun-Uranus square 1°48' mundo, Pluto 7° off MC). Transiting Mercury partile square MC. There was a plan in motion, but he wasn't in on the plan.

It's tricky drawing conclusions from these charts since we aren't yet certain NLRs are valid, or where they fit in terms of importance. Nonetheless, what they suggest matches what all the other charts suggest to me.

[Jim Eshelman]

Based on these charts only, my conclusions are:

• Lee Harvey Oswald either killed Pres. Kennedy or was part of a team that killed him.
• Oswald was personally involved in the violence on November 22 that showed in his chart more dramatically and vividly - a bigger event - than his own murder two days later.
• He saw these actions (correctly) as defining the peak opportunity of his life (though he may have seen it differently than simply going down in history - if part of a team, he may have expected other regard or status pay-off that he didn't get).
• He was duped. The situation wasn't what he expected. He was the patsy he claimed he was, a sacrificial lamb.

My personal opinion after seeing these things in the chart (ideas in my own head more than in the charts):

• Oswald was in somebody's employ, almost certainly the CIA or a similar agency.
• He had been on U.S. assignment in Russia, might have been trying to go to Cuba (probably not?), but had been enrolled in the plan and assigned to Dallas by at least September.
• From the science, others probably did the actual killing. It was always intended he would be suspected and arrested, then killed.
• He didn't know that this was the plan.

Guilty of conspiracy. Guilty of intent to murder. Probably not guilty of murder except by being part of the plan. Killed as part of the plan.

FWIW.

[SteveS]

Jim, give us your take on Oswald's Natal, thanks.

[Jim Eshelman]

Jim, give us your take on Oswald's Natal, thanks.

That's not straightforward. The potential to be a murderer is certainly there. Everything would be a fair bit clearer if (what we know of) his military records didn't report him as a mediocre shot at best.

What might make him a murderer? Sagittarius Moon ties for most common Moon-sign of murderers. The Libra Sun is less clear since, in its healthy forms, it desires peace, but the "damaged, overcompensating masculinity" types commonly flip the other way. We have at least two or three other significant Libra-Sagittarius murders - but also (interestingly) significant strategic military figures (from Goebbels to Patton, among others).

Two other things are strongly consistent with potential for murder. One is a strong (mundane) Venus-Mars square - by far the most common aspect for murderers. The other is his exactly angular Neptune, the only planet I have seen consistently scoring high in every study of murderers I've seen or done. - So, yes, he was capable of killing.

But the military interpretation is even easier. I'll come back to that.

Several indications in his natal suggest that he was best suited for comfortable, privileged life. Consider his Venus- and Jupiter-ruled luminaries, Jupiter on MC, and 0°16' Moon-Jupiter (mundane) square. Yet, what we know of Oswald doesn't fit this. He wasn't visibly ambitious. He didn't have money. So we should interpret him more like somebody suited for an easy lifestyle that never got one.

There is so little we know for sure about his psyche.

The military angle is that the Sagittarian Moon is heavy duty-driven sometimes, responds naturally to hierarchy and issues of rank, is natural with weapons and otherwise "fits the mold." His 0°32' Mercury-Mars square is strategic, tactical, able to deliver efficiently on a plan etc.

His three foreground planets are Moon, Jupiter, and Neptune - that's the chart of an actor! His two strongest are Jupiter and Neptune (the former from angularity, Moon aspect, Moon sign; the latter from exact angularity). One might think he was living in a fantasy world without particular direction - but, for someone like that, he lived a fascinating life of foreign intrigue. I think he was more comfortable with pretend-life and intrigue, but was pretty successful at that! - and Saturn is his third strongest planet, so he was a practical, materially effective figure when he wanted.

It's almost like he was living his life to have a movie made out of it - or as if he was part of a movie in the first place.

He has one hidden thing that I don't know how much to emphasize: His exactly angular Neptune is 1°12' from square Uranus in azimuth. I'm not sure I'd add anything from tis that disagrees with the rest of the chart but, perhaps, it plays up that Uranus-Neptune need to discover the myth that you are living. It's a strange aspect that is consistent with his seeming sense of wanderlust and a feeling that life is stranger and more mysterious than people ever told you. Still, I'm not clear how important this might be.

His Moon is well-aspected. I don't see typical patterns of mental illness. His upbringing was OK though not awesome. It plays up the wanderlust of the internationally wandering Sagittarius Moon. I don't think he was mentally ill (and that has never been asserted as an explanation, though he was thought "emotionally disturbed" by a psychiatrist when he was arrested as a juvenile).

His Sun has harder aspects. It's in its fall opposite Saturn and square Pluto. (You can add Ma/As midpoint 18'.) He didn't have a tough life, but there is toughness, perhaps even brutality, in his temperament. The Libra placement makes this complicated - I'd need more assessment or in-person watching him to have a clear sense of how much this acted as a debilitated Sun, or as a smooth cover and routinely nice guy, or as overcompensation for emasculation. But think of these Saturn and Pluto aspects to a Libra Sun as resembling a Venus-Saturn and Venus-Pluto combination on his Sun. There is a heartlessness to this overall.

His Mercury has mixed malefic-benefic aspects, but the really important ones are the exact square to Mars and close sextile to Moon. He was bright, cagey, thinking, curious, strategic, creative, sharp at assessment, quick-thinking.

Venus is at home in Libra and rules Sun's sign. It's harshly aspected, though, with a close square to Mars, moderate square to Pluto and opposition to Saturn, etc. The conjunction with Mercury reinforced gracious communication, a little bit of charm with his words, but the other aspects show a passionate person but capable of emotional hardness and brutality. I would think him potentially capable of doing anything we might call heartless.

His Mars, exalted in Capricorn, is most powerfully square Mercury and Venus - passionate and strategic - then goes on to have a slightly wider square to Saturn (mundo). I'm not sure this adds anything new, but seems to tighten up the sense of tough, efficient, strategic, etc.

[Jim Eshelman]

Here's something I haven't seen addressed: Oswald's synastry with JFK.

Oswald does seem to have had something personal against Kennedy. He would at least have been persuadable to side strongly against him. Here is the fatal set of interchanges - not foreordained to result in murder, but certainly suggesting negative regard:

0°11' Can - JFK MC
0°58' Lib - LHO Sun
3°54' Can - JFK Saturn
4°02' Lib - JFK EP-a
4°08' Ari - LHO Saturn

This seems the most important connection. There are only two others. The only one that seems to matter is that Oswald's Uranus was on Kennedy's important Mercury-Mars-Jupiter conjunction:

24°50' Ari - JFK Mars
27°00' Ari - JFK Mercury
27°08' Ari - LHO Uranus
29°27' Ari - JFK Jupiter

this doesn't tell us much that is clear. The closest interchange, Uranus to Mercury, mostly suggests Oswald opens Kennedy to new experiences (no, I do not intend a strange, bad joke here of saying whoever pulled the trigger really opened Kennedy's mind). The aspect has no really clear meaning other than perhaps the idea exciting Oswald to new experiences. The only violent interchange is the Mars-Uranus, has no particular details that have obvious meaning. I suspect this interchange is a clue to how the idea of this event intrigued Oswald, but I can't be more specific than that.

The only other interchange was Oswald's Pluto conjunct JFK's Neptune 8'. I'm not going to attempt anything with that.

[Jim Eshelman]

I'm now finding psychiatric evaluations about him that seem to have pre-existed his becoming notorious. They play up what I call the "emasculated Libra" version with the Neptune (and Jupiter-Neptune) elements strong, and emphasize antisocial behavior from an early age.

A psychiatrist when he was in 7th grade described LHO as immersed in a "vivid fantasy life, turning around the topics of omnipotence and power, through which he tries to compensate for his present shortcomings and frustrations." He found him "quite emotionally disturbed" with schizotypal symptoms, which is not what I see from the chart. (I could be wrong, or circumstances could have brought out the worst, or the psychiatrist could have been wrong.)

BTW, there are lots of reports that he had reading and spelling problems that seriously impacted him at school. I suspect he was dyslexic: I've known a lot of Libra dyslexics and wouldn't be surprised if Oswald (who generally has a bright, curious chart) were another.

[SteveS]

Thanks Jim.

[SteveS]

Jim, if I remember correctly, you absolutely do not believe “the psychological coloring of the Asc depends on the zodiacal sign”, correct?

[Jim Eshelman]

Jim, if I remember correctly, you absolutely do not believe “the psychological coloring of the Asc depends on the zodiacal sign”, correct?

As stated, that's too extreme. I think Ascendant shows a facade, some stylizations, etc., just nothing central to the character. Are you detecting something in Oswald's Gemini Ascendant?

From the book I'm in the course of writing:

...in practice, signs on angles (including Ascendant) are minor factors. You can ignore them or pay only slight attention to them without penalty. This view... is consistent with my experience, statistical assessment of documented character traits against ascending signs, and the view of Sidereal Astrology’s founders. For example, Cyril Fagan (as quoted in The Solunars Handbook) summarized his view unambiguously:

But under no circumstances can the ascending constellation describe one’s manner or character.

Also:

Ascendant’s sign describes a superficial layer of behavior: one’s immediate presentation to the world. As Sun discloses character (persistent traits from one’s core being) and Moon shows personality and mannerisms (results of social and circumstantial adaptations), the rising constellation shows the psychological equivalent of how one “dresses it up”: one’s presentation, façade, or branding.

It answers the question, “Which kind of poseur is this person?” (presuming that everyone is, to some extent, a poser).

Here is where my aforementioned blind spot intrudes: My Sun and Ascendant are both in Virgo. When Sun (core identity) has the same expression as Ascendant (façade), what you see is what you get. Because I am wired this way, the particular veneer signified by Ascendant is transparent to me. My eyes focus past it, not on it. I am interested in the authentic heart of a person and never developed a reflex for responding to their surface presentation. Without extra effort, I miss the presentation layer altogether... We can say that you are your Sun-sign, with the style of your Moon-sign, dressed up like your Ascendant...

[SteveS]

Thanks Jim. First, there is no way I would ever be able to synthesize a Natal reading as you can, you truly/definitely have a gift for reading Natals. And, I agree with everything you have said about Oswald in this entire thread. We both agree Oswald could well have been involved in the shooting of JLK, but not as the sole shooter.

When I first computed Oswald’s Natal this morning, my eyes were immediately drawn to what I think is the primary signature of his Natal: His Neptune partile cnj his MC, this was a big wow for me realizing he was involved in probably the greatest conspiracy this Country has ever seen. As having a high interest in Cosmobiology as you have I know, my next immediate step would have been to analyze Oswald’s midpoints structures with his Natal Neptune-MC, and it calculates a Mo/AS 90 = Nep = MC , also Mo/AS = EP a as a direct midpoint. When I saw this huge planetary picture involving his Neptune-MC as a strong symbol as a probable patsy and/or as a possible conspirator bells started going off in my mind, thinking we have here a Native that was dominated by his Natal Neptune-MC, strongly colored by his ASC & Moon using the methodology of the Cosmobiologist’s. And, by your extensive research with signs and a Sag Moon statistically being with murderers, my mind leaped to his ASC being a Scorpio ASC. The Cosmobiologist use one’s ASC as a coloring factor for psychological feelings, and I know the accidents considered the rising degree as of upmost importance as a cosmic symbolic factor. I do know this: pertaining to my own life I feel my Lib ASC played a huge “dress-up/coloring factor in my life in my business world of so many different relationships which I had to balance with so many different important people with the distribution arms (major film companies) for contracting movies. I psychologically feel that my Lib ASC was a natural gift for me in getting along so-well with important people in the distribution business of movies.

Also, I notice as another Cosmobiology factor Oswald important partile Me-Ma 90 is involved in his natal with a direct midpoint of ME/MA = EP = ASC/ MO = NEP/MC. Because of your Natal reading of Oswald with my eye on midpoints, I now believe much more so Oswald was involved in the shooting of JFK.
Jim when you have time, I really would appreciate how you would have read/synthetized for any native who came to you asking you for life advice to possible life red flags with the same Natal as Oswald? Thank you so much Jim for your read on Oswald’s Natal---it really opened my eyes/mind to certain key astrological influences in Oswald’s life.

[Jim Eshelman]

...what I think is the primary signature of his Natal: His Neptune partile cnj his MC, this was a big wow for me realizing he was involved in probably the greatest conspiracy this Country has ever seen.

I think that's one of the big things. I disagree only in that I consider his Jupiter to be equally strong: Like Neptune, it scores at 100% strength - due to the combination of Sagittarian Moon and the close Moon-Jupiter square (mundane square), on top of which Jupiter is foreground. (In Pisces, lol!)

I do know this: pertaining to my own life I feel my Lib ASC played a huge “dress-up/coloring factor in my life in my business world of so many different relationships which I had to balance with so many different important people with the distribution arms (major film companies) for contracting movies. I psychologically feel that my Lib ASC was a natural gift for me in getting along so-well with important people in the distribution business of movies.

I would expect that in your chart but for a different reason: I don't consider Libra rising all that important but - given that Jupiter is closely foreground - I consider Jupiter's sign important. That is, I don't just think of it as Jupiter rising but as Jupiter in Libra rising. - I wouldn't normally pay serious attention to a Jupiter sign, but I do interpret foreground planets in terms of their signs.

On my Jupiter in Libra page I note that - in the Gauquelin character trait data - Jupiter in Libra was statistically high for the character trait charming. I wrote: "You can't get more Libran than charming. This likely implies social graces and social generosity, mostly reflected in the eminent examples below. Indeed, personal examples are mostly people with whom it's natural to have a drink in a lovely environment for some gracious conversation (a context for diplomacy). Settings and manners seem important to most of them."

But with Oswald, I don't understand what you are making of his Gemini Ascendant. I'm not clear what was distinctly Geminian about him. What are you seeing?

Jim when you have time, I really would appreciate how you would have read/synthetized for any native who came to you asking you for life advice to possible life red flags with the same Natal as Oswald?

It depends on the background and the context. According to biographical summaries of him, his early life was far worse than the chart suggests. His Moon is in good shape, for example. Five things stand out that I would need to focus on in counseling him:

1. First, I'd need to know the early life conditions. If they were really as difficult and psychologically undercutting as people have interpreted, it would be beyond an astrologer to help him unless that astrologer was a trained psychotherapist.

2. Second, if I got to him young enough, I'd point out he probably has dyslexia. They have ways of working with that now so people don't feel stupid. This probably would have made a positive dramatic difference in his life.

3. Third, he was a Libra man growing up in a time that a man had to be "a man's man." This contributed to his confusion about what to do with his life, probably driving him to the Marines to compensate, feeding his low self-esteem. This issue - accepting himself as he really was even if that meant enhancing traits thought (especially in his time) "too feminine," enhancing especially a connection to the arts - is one of the big issues in his development, I'm sure. Gains here would be big gains.

4. Fourth (and slightly related to #3), her needed a primarily creative outlet. He was a natural for theater, we wanted an audience, he had an instinct for playing roles, and he had a deliciously creative mind if unleashed.

5. Finally, I don't know what practical approach to take - that would come from talking to him - but his chart is that of someone who is better made for a comfortable lifestyle, more aristocratic in temperament. He never had or took a shot at this. He was born into poor conditions. But I'd try to give him a sense of understanding himself by knowing that yes, he was in fact born to thrive best in that kind of life. This perhaps would have given him a sense that he wasn't crazy (since it was likely his natural instinct) and give him motivation to work on improving himself, playing to the best parts of his Sagittarian Moon.

[SteveS]

Jim wrote:

I think that's one of the big things. I disagree only in that I consider his Jupiter to be equally strong: Like Neptune, it scores at 100% strength - due to the combination of Sagittarian Moon and the close Moon-Jupiter square (mundane square), on top of which Jupiter is foreground. (In Pisces, lol!)

That’s interesting. No way would I have the astrological analytical depth like you for synthetizing a Natal this way. By far, your analytical depth far exceeds mine with natal readings, yours is much more detailed than mine--better. My astrology reads things more-- how close an aspect is to partile since I feel so strongly that partile aspects (1 degree orb or less) “Reign Supreme” in a chart; therefore, I see Oswald Neptune partile cnj his MC as by far his dominating Natal Chart signature. Don’t get me wrong, he has a very strong angular Jupiter, but my first task if I was reading Oswald chart for him for advice would be to start with his Natal Neptune and how it is structured with other aspects including midpoints. I would soon discover he has many important midpoints wired into his Natal Neptune which tells me he is headed for a complex Neptunian experiences in life, which easily could develope into a negative loop of life.
Jim wrote:

I wouldn't normally pay serious attention to a Jupiter sign, but I do interpret foreground planets in terms of their signs.

.
Jim wrote:

On my Jupiter in Libra page I note that - in the Gauquelin character trait data - Jupiter in Libra was statistically high for the character trait charming. I wrote: "You can't get more Libran than charming. This likely implies social graces and social generosity, mostly reflected in the eminent examples below. Indeed, personal examples are mostly people with whom it's natural to have a drink in a lovely environment for some gracious conversation (a context for diplomacy). Settings and manners seem important to most of them."

Another excellent point why you are so good with your analytical gifts for reading in-depth a Natal Chart. I always wondered in my life why the business executives from the distribution branch in Atlanta like me so much and favored me in competitive situations with the best movies. When I got into astrology and started learning about Jupiter, so much more understanding came to me as a businessman for doing even better business. I guess most astrologers would contribute this to Jupiter luck, but I contribute it just as much to me spending a-lot of time developing each and every one of my business relationships in very specia (Libra ways), so much in fact, I became friends with a few of em. After learning astrology things I realized my Libra ASC probably also had to do with my relationships in life, its called enlightenment . All kinds of close relationships are very important, it takes time to develop em and in today's busy world there is hardly no time to develope relationships. So much business today is not done one on one with people. But I digress—our rising ASC sign may exert more psychological effects than we realize, but I am not going to make a big deal about it.
Jim wrote and asked:

But with Oswald, I don't understand what you are making of his Gemini Ascendant. I'm not clear what was distinctly Geminian about him. What are you seeing?

Jim, I was looking at an AM time instead of PM time, sorry.

Are we looking at different Natal Charts Jim?

[SteveS]

Jim wrote:

Five things stand out that I would need to focus on in counseling him:

First, I'd need to know the early life conditions. If they were really as difficult and psychologically undercutting as people have interpreted, it would be beyond an astrologer to help him unless that astrologer was a trained psychotherapist.

Exactly Jim! This is why I only like to do readings for my family and friends and there have been very few Natal readings but lots and lots of Solunar readings.

Second, if I got to him young enough, I'd point out he probably has dyslexia. They have ways of working with that now so people don't feel stupid. This probably would have made a positive dramatic difference in his life.

I understand Jim. I would have pointed out to Oswald his dominating Neptune and it as a possible Red Flag for his life development.

Third, he was a Libra man growing up in a time that a man had to be "a man's man." This contributed to his confusion about what to do with his life, probably driving him to the Marines to compensate, feeding his low self-esteem. This issue - accepting himself as he really was even if that meant enhancing traits thought (especially in his time) "too feminine," enhancing especially a connection to the arts - is one of the big issues in his development, I'm sure. Gains here would be big gains.

Again, one of the main reasons you are so great with your gift of Natal readings Jim, you are a professional expert at reading signs for people and their lives, I am not.

Fourth (and slightly related to #3), he needed a primarily creative outlet. He was a natural for theater, we wanted an audience, he had an instinct for playing roles, and he had a deliciously creative mind if unleashed.

Yes, I would not have had the astrological depth to discuss this with him, only the cautionary possible Red Flag with his potent Neptune.

Finally, I don't know what practical approach to take - that would come from talking to him - but his chart is that of someone who is better made for a comfortable lifestyle, more aristocratic in temperament. He never had or took a shot at this. He was born into poor conditions. But I'd try to give him a sense of understanding himself by knowing that yes, he was in fact born to thrive best in that kind of life. This perhaps would have given him a sense that he wasn't crazy (since it was likely his natural instinct) and give him motivation to work on improving himself, playing to the best parts of his Sagittarian Moon.

Excellent! Again, you truly have a gift Jim for reading Natals. Thanks so much Jim.

[Jim Eshelman]

Oh, I did not realize we were not on the same page with Oswald ASC. I see Scorpio as his ASC. His Natal Chart below: https://ibb.co/Kx6LyQm

Are we looking at different Natal Charts Jim?

Yes, It's an AM/PM error. Oswald was born 9:55 PM. You've calculated the chart for 9:55 AM. (I'd missed you were saying Neptune on MC, since I'm so used to seeing it on IC.)

You wouldn't have gotten the same relative rankings I did because Moon's aspects would have been wrong for 9:55 AM. The technique for ranking the relative strength of the ten needs associated with the planets is easy, though - just tedious - using this technique:
https://solunars.com/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=6031
One day we'll get this little detail added to TMSA (an easy enough thing to do) but for now I take half a minute to calculate it for each chart.

The ideas won't be strange to you: The strength of the demand of the underlying psychological force of each planet gets stronger when the planet is emphasized in various ways, specifically by angularity, hard aspect to a luminary, ruling (or exalted in) a luminary sign, or being stationary. It was then just a matter of working out the relative importance of each. If you read the top post on the thread you'll see that each planet gets the one strongest score of these four considerations (you don't add them up) except a planet that rules a luminary sign AND aspects a luminary gets bumped up a bit. Here's my worksheet for each of Oswald's planets - same for Sun in Libra (Saturn exalted) and in close opposition to Saturn. It's all mechanical, reading aspect and angularity scores right off of the TMSA chart:

NEPTUNE (100): angularity = 100%
JUPITER (100): sq Moon (0°16') = 100%
SATURN (95): Sun in Libra (90%) + Class 1 opposition to Sun adds 5%
VENUS (90): Sun in Libra (90%)
MOON (85): angularity = 85%
PLUTO (74): square Sun (3°42' mundo) = 74%
SUN (44): angularity = 44%
MARS (31): angularity = 31%
MERCURY (21): angularity = 21%
URANUS (7): angularity = 7%

[SteveS]

Thanks Jim, I will remove the Natal I posted and written astrological content I posted, sorry--my bad. Folks, all the midpoints I posted about Oswald are in error, sorry.

[Jim Eshelman]

To make it easy to regroup: Steve, here is a TMSA midpoint report using your definitions (90' orbs, only counting the conjunction and opposition as "direct").

Code: Select all

Mo Sg    |    Su/Ju 54'd   
Su Li-   |    Ma/As 18'd      Ju/Ur 69'd   
Ve Li+   |    Ma/Pl 51'd   
Ju Pi    |    Ma/Ur  8'd   
Ur Ar    |    Ju/As 58'd   
Pl Cn    |    Ve/Sa 41'd   
As Ge    |    Su/Mc 62'd   

[SteveS]

Got it Jim, thanks.

After realizing I was looking at the wrong chart of Oswald, I now am back to my original thinking he may not have been involved in the shooting of Kennedy at all-- and agree with Jim’s words here:

Going by this chart only, he seems more the victim than the victimizer, very much the patsy played for a fool. Read simply, from the beginning, this chart looks to me far more like the chart of someone who was a victim than a victimizer.

Go to this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4FDDuRSgzFk at about 1:30 minutes and you hear Oswald state he was use as a patsy (“a person easily manipulated or victimized”), probably realizing with what has been proven with his background history with government influencers, he was used as a patsy to be seen as the lone shooter, which there are many eye witness proving evidence there was a shooter on the grassy knoll. For sure he shows no derangement mental state by bragging/boasting/smiling that he just killed the President of the USA.